How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

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Eafonte
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby Eafonte » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:47 am

Besides reading a lot of L2 literature fiction (mixing intensive and extensive reading), a knowledge of L2 word-building rules, cramming of L2 roots, and reading of thematic dictionaries/word lists has helped me a lot in the language acquisition process.
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Not Daryl
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby Not Daryl » Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:42 pm

einzelne wrote:Apple just release iOS 15 and I must stay that I'm pleasantly surprised by the fact how user-friendly iPad's ecosystem has become for reading parallel texts. Here I have the Kindle app with the original on the left and iBooks on the right with the translation).

Minimalist and distraction free. Ideal for close reading and intensive sessions!

For einzelne, what size iPad did you take that screenshot from?
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einzelne
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby einzelne » Thu Oct 21, 2021 1:50 am

Not Daryl wrote:what size iPad did you take that screenshot from?


iPad (6 generation) 9,7 inches (I would prefer the last iPad Air though…)
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BeaP
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby BeaP » Thu Oct 28, 2021 7:52 pm

Maybe we should make a distinction between reading and studying texts. Everybody meets new words in novels written in their native language as well, and this doesn't hinder the enjoyment or the understanding. Unknown words only cause problems if you want to study a text in an academic way.
When I was at university, the internet wasn't widespread yet, we used printed dictionaries. I quickly realised that because of the time pressure I had two choices: read everything in Hungarian or read the original without a dictionary (I know, the advice you don't want). I chose the latter. It didn't work with very archaic texts, but worked with everything else, and after 2-3 years I was able to read and analyze basically any text. I also read studies on literature, had to talk about novels in class, and had to write essays about novels. I didn't learn any words on purpose. If you think about it, your native language works the same way. You don't meet very rare Russian words from classics in your everyday life, you still remember them somehow, without using Anki. It's because you've read a lot, and I think this is the key. I don't know if this process can be made faster.
Another important aspect for me is that the classics are not on the same level of difficulty. I have a list of the novels I'd like to read, and if I find one too difficult, I postpone reading it, and look for an easier one. I usually find hard postmodern novels, and harder anything that dates back before the 17th century. Those in between can be surprisingly easy.
Also: some texts in my opinion need to be studied, because they are so dense, others can simply be read. I'll give you an example: I can easily read 2666 in Spanish, but I postponed Rayuela (Hopscotch), because some parts of it are as dense as a poem. I still need a lot of vocabulary to be able to appreciate it.
And lastly, I've also recognised that not understanding something is not alway the result of poor language skills. I started to read Tyll by Kehlmann, and I couldn't make head or tail of it. I was interested in the book so much, that I started to read the Hungarian translation. I quickly found out that I didn't like the novel, couldn't concentrate while reading it, always lost focus, and that's why I didn't understand it.
My strategy is usually this: I find something that I can read because it's close to my level, look up some words only, that I think are very important for understanding the text, and try to read 2-3 essays later on the novel. I never read things I don't enjoy.
And an important thing just came to my mind: at the university we read a lot of poetry. We sometimes spent 90 minutes talking about one poem, that we had to analyse at home before the class. During that time we almost learned the poem by heart. I think this also helped me to broaden my vocabulary, and it's not without a reason that learning poems is such a common task in our schools.
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einzelne
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby einzelne » Fri Oct 29, 2021 2:55 am

BeaP wrote:Maybe we should make a distinction between reading and studying texts.


I think it's a very useful distinction. What I had in mind when I was asking this question was texts like Rayuela — something you really like and would like to savor every sentence, every word in the original. (Needless to say, I never read classical literature simply becasue of its canonical status — I only choose the works and writers I feel strong affinity with)

I think you strategy definitely works (I read quite a few canonical works of English literature extensively on paper), provided you're in the university and have tons of tome to read tons of books. Sadly, it's not my situation. But it was interesting to read about your experience!
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BeaP
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby BeaP » Fri Oct 29, 2021 8:06 am

I have very little free time nowadays, so I understand your problem. Moreover, upon further reflection I have to add that I don't think it's only a vocabulary problem. At least not in my case. There are some novels that I can't even read with a dictionary. On the other hand, there are some that I think I 'get' even without knowing all the words. Just an idea: If you like Proust so much, maybe you could concentrate on his language use. Explanatory texts help a lot, because they give you the cultural and biographical references, they highlight the key words, and tell you their meanings or possible interpretations. Textbooks for French high school students and university students or just studies and essays on Proust are really helpful.
Just as a side note, Proust is one of my favourite authors to 'savour'. My French level is B2, and for me his texts can be enjoyed even with this limited knowledge. I think a lot of classics work this way.
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Re: How do you go about vocabulary while reading ‘classical’ works?

Postby einzelne » Fri Oct 29, 2021 4:48 pm

BeaP wrote:Just an idea: If you like Proust so much, maybe you could concentrate on his language use.


I like him, but mentioned him just an example. In case of Proust, my problem is not his language (when I was reading him, I actually found his writing smooth and easy going) but time or, rather, the lack of it... Sadly, I cannot find time to read all 7 novels even in translation (I read his first 3 novels, the first two a couple of times and even read him in English.)
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