I came up with a new way of explaining the Spanish subjunctive, it does not involve doubt and uncertainty

[frank_cascade]

You know the story of the emperor's new clothes? I feel like the Spanish subjunctive has been going around naked. While learning Spanish, everyone from teachers to students and every grammar book has used the same words to explain the Spanish subjunctive, "doubt and uncertainty". The subjunctive is complex and I am not saying that doubt and uncertainty is the only explanation that has been used to explain it but, it certainly has been the flagship explanation. Anyway, I didn't think doubt and uncertainty was a good explanation, so I came up with my own. It is all to do with control. See below for my analysis and please note that the objective of the post is to challenge the doubt and uncertainty explanation. I am not saying my explanation is perfect nor even complete.

Consider the sentences below

Es nesesario que comamos (It’s necessary that we eat)

Quiero que hablen (I want that they speak)

Do the sentences above contain or convey doubt and uncertainty? “It’s necessary that we eat” is an assertive statement. The person who uses such a sentence is not uncertain or doubtful about what they are saying and there is no doubt over how the sentence could be interpreted.

I had been struggling with the subjunctive until one day I asked myself a simple question, “could the reason why I am having a hard time understanding the subjunctive be because it has nothing to do with doubt and uncertainty?”. If the answer is yes, then two questions naturally follow (1) why does everyone keep explaining it using doubt and uncertainty? and (2) what is the correct explanation?

What my analysis has revealed is that the answer to the very first question is indeed yes. Yes, the reason the subjunctive has been hard to understand is because it has (almost) nothing to do with doubt and uncertainty. As for the follow up questions, for (1), the answer is simple. People keep using the doubt and uncertainty explanation because that is what they themselves were also told growing up. As for (2), make sure you are sitting down first. I am about to tell you of a new and simple way of explaining the subjunctive.

It came to me one day as I was sitting looking at conjugation tables. I noticed something that I had noticed before. The verb endings for the imperative are the same as the endings for the subjunctive (the majority of them).

I did the same thing I had done before, I asked a few simple questions. The questions I asked were:

Is it more than just a coincidence that the imperative and the subjunctive use the same endings?

Are they connected and If they are connected, what is the connection?

They indeed are connected and the connection is summed up in one word, “control”. Both the imperative and the subjunctive are about control. The imperative is used when giving orders and commands. Commands and orders (even suggestions) are used when intending to control. As for the subjunctive, how it connects to control is not very obvious but that is all part of it. I will illustrate using the same example sentences from before:

Es necesario que comamos (It’s necessary that we eat)

Quiero que hablen (I want that they speak)

Now that I have pointed it out, it is easy to see that these sentences are actually about control. “It’s necessary that we eat” is just an alternative way of saying “let’s eat” or “we must eat”. A person who says “I want that they speak” is expressing his/her desire that others do what he/she wants them to do. Both statements are about control. They are not as direct as commands but as I said before, that is all part of it. The subjunctive is used when indirectly intending to control.

There is more. Let’s analyze other sentences in the subjunctive:

Espero que venga (I hope he comes)

Solo te pido que tengas cuidado (I only ask that you be careful)

Es para que te acuerdes de mi (It’s so that you remember me)

Que lo pases bien (Have a good time)

As with the sentences from before, these sentences express a desire to have things be a certain way.

There is more. Consider the sentences below:

Me sorprende que no hable ingles (It surprises me that he doesn’t speak English)

Es possible que haya problemas (It’s possible that there are problems)

Voy a comer antes de que vengan (I am going to eat before they come)

Me alegro de que puedas venir (I am happy that you can come)

The aspect of control is not so obvious in the sentences above but it is there. The sentences pertain to control but, not in a clear way. The sentences above all say different things but, one thing they all do is concede an inability to control. A person who says “it’s possible that there are problems” concedes an inability to control his/her environment. This concession of inability to control is also present in the other sentences.

There you have it. The Spanish subjunctive is about control. It could be control when desiring that things be a certain way or it could be when conceding an inability to control.

[Querneus]

I think the best approach is neither a stringent "doubt and uncertainty" or "[lack of] control", but recognizing that there's some general theme along those lines. And then some patterns, which hardly have anything to do with the general theme, just have to be memorized. You don't have to explain every little use as an extension of the "doubt & uncertainty" or "lack of control" themes. In the end the various individual patterns are more important; the theme just helps you remember them.


A few data points you might like follow.


En ese momento, tuve el accidente. La persona que me ayudó a salir del coche se acercó, y además me dio primeros auxilios.
'At that moment, I had the accident. The person that helped me get out of the car approached, and also gave me first aid.'
En ese momento, tuve el accidente. Empecé a preocuparme, esperando a que alguien me ayudara. Alguien se acercó.
'At that moment, I had the accident. I began to worry, waiting for someone to help me. Someone approached.'

In both examples, the speaker has very little control about whether anyone will show up and help. In the first example, the listener already knows that someone did show up, and the speaker recalls this using the definite article (la persona) and the indicative (ayudó). In the second example, it is very uncertain whether anyone was going to show up, so an indefinite pronoun is used (alguien) and as it happens the subjunctive (ayudara). Then at the end it is mentioned someone did approach. This contrast of certain indicative vs. uncertain subjunctive is typical of relative clauses.

I love your use of "lack of control" to explain the subjunctive "hortative" and "jussive" (visitémoslos 'let's visit them', que se vayan 'they should leave; I want them to leave'), but it has its downsides from other points of view.



Cuando venga, lo terminamos. 'When I come back, we'll finish it.'
Si vengo, lo terminamos. 'If I come back, we'll finish it.'

The two sentences are similar. Some languages like Arabic and historical German don't always even distinguish these two meanings—this is how 'wenn', cognate of English 'when' and Spanish 'cuando', ended up meaning 'if' in modern German. Both involve the future, of which we're never fully certain, and not fully in control. Interestingly, the sentence that is more certain with greater control has the subjunctive (cuando venga), while the uncertain one and less controlled has the indicative (si vengo). These are uses that should be simply memorized.



By the way, in Latin American Spanish, verbs/nouns/adjectives of emotion can be used with both indicative and subjunctive. The subjunctive expresses that you have pretty high but not 100% complete belief in the reason for the emotion, while the indicative shows complete confidence.

Me sorprende que no hable inglés. 'I'm surprised she doesn't speak English.' (I don't fully believe she doesn't, but it's likely.)
Me sorprende que no habla inglés. 'I'm surprised he doesn't speak English.' (And I know for a fact he doesn't.)

[frank_cascade]

@Ser

I completely agree with “there is a general theme and some patterns which hardly have nothing to do with the general theme”. Another way to say that would be to see the subjunctive as a fleet with a main flagship and smaller supporting ships.

Looking at the sentence, ‘cuando venga, lo terminamos’, I have been told that when ‘cuando’ is used with the subjunctive in the future tense, it corresponds to “whenever” and that another use of the subjunctive is to express the English “ever”. See another example below

Compra el coche que quieras - “buy whatever car you want”

[Querneus]

I completely agree with “there is a general theme and some patterns which hardly have nothing to do with the general theme”. Another way to say that would be to see the subjunctive as a fleet with a main flagship and smaller supporting ships.

You're a nicely metaphorical person. (I find the metaphor cute and interesting.)

Looking at the sentence, ‘cuando venga, lo terminamos’, I have been told that when ‘cuando’ is used with the subjunctive in the future tense, it corresponds to “whenever”

Yeah, sometimes. I don't think that's the more common meaning, but it's definitely common. I think I tend to say "siempre que" and "cada vez que" more often to express the notion of 'whenever':

Siempre que te enojes así, trata de calmarte.
'Whenever you get angry like that, try to calm down.'

...which could also be "cada vez que te enojes", or "cuando te enojes".

it corresponds to “whenever” and that another use of the subjunctive is to express the English “ever”. See another example below

Compra el coche que quieras - “buy whatever car you want”

Yeah. Also: le dije que comprara el coche que quisiera 'I told him to buy whatever car he wanted'.

You can sometimes find the indicative too though. I think it has something to do with the action actually being carried out or failing to happen as a fact, as opposed to some sort of uncertain prospect (subjunctive), but I should read more about this.

Compró el coche que quiso. 'She bought / She did buy whatever car she wanted.' (Or simply: 'the car she wanted'.)
Compró el coche que le dio la santa gana comprar. 'She bought whatever car she damn felt like buying.' (Or: 'the car she damn felt like buying'.)

For me at least, *Compró el coche que quisiera is wrong.

[StringerBell]

I think your explanation was brilliant and makes a lot of sense. Thank you for taking the time to share it. Everything you said about Spanish seems to apply to Italian, as well.

[frank_cascade]

@StringerBell, It applies well to French also.

oh, and say hello to Avon Barksdale

[smallwhite]

Why can an explanation apply to 3 languages that use the subjunctive differently?

[Raconteur]

oh, and say hello to Avon Barksdale

[Cainntear]

Is it more than just a coincidence that the imperative and the subjunctive use the same endings?

Yes, and it is no mere coincidence that the English subjunctive now looks indistinguishable from the imperative: have a nice day is a wish, not an order. I also think it's no coincidence that it was a native English speaker who came to this conclusion. One of your own examples...

Que lo pases bien (Have a good time)

Now that I have pointed it out, it is easy to see that these sentences are actually about control. “It’s necessary that we eat” is just an alternative way of saying “let’s eat” or “we must eat”. A person who says “I want that they speak” is expressing his/her desire that others do what he/she wants them to do. Both statements are about control. They are not as direct as commands but as I said before, that is all part of it. The subjunctive is used when indirectly intending to control.

Except that "will you", "can you", "would you", "could you", "you might want to" and many other constructions are also used to give indirect commands, and it is the very fact that they're not commands that makes them indirect.

For example, "let's eat" could be indirected to give "we should eat". We could also interpret "necessario que comamos" as an indirect request: "I'm hungry. Can we eat now?"

No, the better distinction is in the technical description that a lot of people are worried will scare people, so they "simplify" it to doubt and uncertainty.

The Spanish subjunctive is an irrealis mood, meaning "unreal". We contrast this with realis mood which is real, or statement of fact. The difference in how the subjunctive is used in different languages is a difference in how the languages distinguish between fact and hypotheticals.

Espero que venga (I hope he comes) Him coming is not "real" -- it might not happen.
Solo te pido que tengas cuidado (I only ask that you be careful) -- he/she might not be careful, so it's not definitely real.
etc.

Quite often, you'll find constructions where there's a choice between indicative or subjunctive, and the distinction seems fairly subtle.

For example, you've got both "cuando digo" and "cuando diga" for the first person. (I've moved away from Ser's example of "venir" because venir has a habit of being used in more subjunctive situations, with indicative situations being more "llegar".) Quite often the difference is glossed in English as being "when I say" vs "whenever I say". The former is real, because I have already decided that I'm going to say something at a specific point; the latter is irreal because I might say something at some as-yet-undecided point in the future. The when/whenever distinction isn't a perfect mapping of English<->Spanish, but it does start to point towards the realis/irrealis difference.

The sentences pertain to control but, not in a clear way. The sentences above all say different things but, one thing they all do is concede an inability to control.

Sorry, but that's a stretch too far. "Me matan!!" implicitly includes inability to control. "Me matan!!" could be interpreted as "help me!"... but it's still in indicative. The sun rising and setting is beyond my control, but it's still indicative. When someone's heartbroken because their beloved "no me quiere", that's out of their control too.


The reason that "doubt and uncertainty" is used as a common explanation is because it's a reasonable first approximation. I personally prefer "you can quote me on it" as a first approximation, as I've seen far too many people confused by "doubt and uncertainty" ("but 'I think' shows uncertainty!" etc.)

Consider this:
Peter: "I don't think John's an idiot."
Newspaper: "John's an idiot" says Peter

Now the newspaper has quoted Peter verbatim, but they've definitely misquoted him. In Spanish, this doesn't work.

Pedro: "No creo que Juan sea idiota."
Periódico: "Juan sea idiota" diga Peter -- clearly meaningless.
Periódico: "Juan es idiota" diga Peter -- 100% misquote.

So when you say "I think" in Spanish, there's an implied "you can quote me on it". After all, whether you say "I think John is an idiot" or "John is an idiot", it's really only your opinion.


Although normally I don't use the newspaper example to explain it normally. What I say is that John walks round a corner and hears "John's an idiot", so he punches Peter in the face. What he didn't hear was "I don't think". That can't happen in Spanish.

[frank_cascade]

Sorry, but that's a stretch too far.

I concede. You are right. It's a bit of a stretch. The "control" explanation I gave has two parts. I always felt the "concede an inability to control' part was shaky. I even considered that maybe the subjunctive is not one single language area. We group things under the same umbrella but it would work better if certain sentence types (e.g. "want/need that . . ." etc) were grouped separately to sentence types like "solo te pido que tengas cuidado". Just coz they have the same endings doesn't mean they should be in the same group.

So when you say "I think" in Spanish, there's an implied "you can quote me on it"

Ok, now your turn. That is a bit of a stretch. "I don't think" sentences are in the subjunctive but "I think" sentences are not. It would work better to just treat them as exceptions and not to stretch the explanation.The Spanish language is too inconsistent within itself for a single explanation to cover all its uses.

The reason the "doubt and uncertainty" explanation didn't work for me is because if you think about it, there will always be an element of uncertainty in anything you say
"mi mother likes my new car" (I can't be certain that she actually does)
"Tim did not call because he doesn't want to talk to you" (I cant be certain that's actually why he didn't call)
etc

What makes it worse, there are times when I can't use the subjunctive even if I actually am doubtful. if I say "she came because she likes me" and I am doubtful about why she actually came, I cant use the subjunctive.

With the subjunctive, use whatever explanation floats your boat. For me the control explanation works very well (for certain sentences).