How long do bloggers think lockdowns last?

[eido]

I can do a review of Duolingo. I recently started using it again for some more "obscure" languages as well as some FIGS. As soon as I get enough data, I'll try to write up a post comparing it to several other sources, like LingoDeer, for example.

I'm all about fair and balanced.

[lavengro]

@lavengro

Thanks Rick, understood and appreciated. I did not intend to refer to you in my comments.

[lavengro]

... I'll try to write up a post comparing it to several other sources, like LingoDeer, for example. ....

Duolingo does a poor job in my opinion for those languages that LingoDeer is most prominently known for (Korean, Japanese, Chinese).

[lavengro]

They solely recommend Duolingo

Are there actually bloggers who solely recommend Duolingo? I would be interested in links.

... on the whole in this post I was critiquing its users, since an app is nothing without its base.

Noted.

[eido]

Duolingo does a poor job in my opinion for those languages that LingoDeer is most prominently known for (Korean, Japanese, Chinese).

Noted.

I wasn't planning on making something so unfair. I think Duolingo and LingoDeer have different methodologies, and since I'm not quite used to DL's method yet, (and want to take advantage of their flagship French) I'll be comparing different languages based on what seems most applicable to the app. I want to make sure I give each app a fair shake, and trust me, I am critical, even of the stuff I like.

I wasn't about to turn it into a free-for-all bash

I know these blogs exist, I'm just having trouble finding the particular ones I was thinking of (some which I'd found before). I have various opinions on some of these blogs/news outlets.
This one recommends Swahili Pod (#29), which is a bit different from the norm but still within bounds since it's suggesting a gaggle of phrases is incredibly impressive (if we're going by the same idea as @rdearman's original post).
This one doesn't recommend specifically Duolingo, but it's in the same spirit as rdearman's OP in that it recommends learning fast, or so it would seem.
This one recommends only DL for its app selection.
Same for this one.

My search in Google was "new skills to learn in quarantine".

[Cavesa]

There are some accomplished language learners on this forum who have used Duolingo as a component of their language learning approach, and who have a different, more positive view of Duolingo. I am not trying to change the negative opinions of some of the senior well-respected posters in this thread who have expressed dismissive views of Duolingo, but just to point out that yours are just opinions rather than facts. And some here have opinions that are different from yours (though given the ferocity of the attack rather than debate, I do not expect many to venture into the thread).

The Duolingo-bashing on this forum used to be based on the perspective that it was using and taking advantage of volunteers to the detriment of those language learning professionals trying to earn a living at teaching a language, then when it started using paid professionals the negative criticism appeared to be that it was forsaking its volunteers. And then criticism that Duolingo says it is free but it is not free because it has the nerve to use ads to pay for its infrastructure, though oddly that criticism does not appear to be made against other similarly-free learning resources. Now the criticism is that it is somehow damaging to language learning, which with every respect seems a little frantic. Have the recent critics tried Duolingo recently? I know one of the posters here in this thread recently advised elsewhere that "I've never actually used it."

I do agree that there has been some toxicity introduced into a language learning community; unfortunately, I think it is this forum rather than the Duolingo community that has become the beneficiary of that toxicity.

I don't propose to engage further in the discussion. While I am not one of the accomplished language learners I referred to at the beginning of the post, I do really like Duolingo generally (it is stronger for some languages than others) as part of a language learning approach and experience (which for me also includes FSI, Pimsleur, in-person classes, lots of native language materials, explicit grammars, etc). But I think I will be happier staying in my own lane while engaging with this forum. And yes, because I am not completely naive, I am fully aware that this post is just an invitation for more Duolingo criticism; you're welcome.

One important question: "When did they use it?" I also used to like Duo as one component of learning. Five years ago, it was a nice small introduction to the basics. But about two years ago, it started changing a lot. The professionally made courses are hyperslow, the structure is more difficult to navigate for people just wanting to review something, the learning mechanisms have been worsened (fewer valuable exercises, more of the dumb ones that will make any learner feel good and click more often, much more focus on points, even more handholding as to the learning pace)

I don't see much criticism concerning the voluteers vs professionals issue (except for the facts that the professionals seem to have far too little time to improve stuff and add alternatives, compared to some of the volunteer teams, and some other stuff), I see mostly criticism of the way the product is evolving. Yes, it is now damaging learning, as it is designed to make you waste time. The hundreds of hours spent on easier and easier exercises (demonstrated by a few learners, who even counted the types of exercises before and after some updates of the websites. on the duo forums, I no longer have access) are hundreds of hours you could have spent elsewhere.

Yes, I have tried it rather recently and yes, that's exactly the source of my criticisms. Duo has worsened. The priority is to keep you playing and seeing ads for as long as possible. Duo even admits it, even though they try to present it differently. In all the pseudoscientific articles, they define a successful learner as one who never leaves Duolingo. They present the learners leaving as failures that gave up, not as the actually successful learners, who took some value and moved on to more challenging sources. That's the problem. Any beginner resource should aim to teach you the content and let you move on. It's like a maths for 1st graders app, that would define success as never progressing to the 2nd grade.

[Cainntear]

Then I think the problem is rather: why are you putting yourself in a situation where you are constantly exposed to this torture, when the simple thing to do is simply not pay any attention to it? I just ignore Duolingo and take it for what it is. I don't have any interest in explaining myself a hundred times either, so I just make sure that I don't.

But the numbers are so overwhelming that they're taking over every online space now. Getting out of the way of all DL learners means getting out of the way of all learners.

Does it? I don't feel like it does, yet.

Are you a member of many Scottish Gaelic learners' groups then...?

[galaxyrocker]

Are you a member of many Scottish Gaelic learners' groups then...?

Irish ones are the same way as well. I've eventually left pretty much all of them on Facebook because of it. It also flooded the group with beginners, so more intermediate/advanced questions got drowned out.

[tarvos]

Then I think the problem is rather: why are you putting yourself in a situation where you are constantly exposed to this torture, when the simple thing to do is simply not pay any attention to it? I just ignore Duolingo and take it for what it is. I don't have any interest in explaining myself a hundred times either, so I just make sure that I don't.

But the numbers are so overwhelming that they're taking over every online space now. Getting out of the way of all DL learners means getting out of the way of all learners.

Does it? I don't feel like it does, yet.

Are you a member of many Scottish Gaelic learners' groups then...?

No, but Duolingo doesn't just exist for Scottish Gaelic...

[Cainntear]

But the numbers are so overwhelming that they're taking over every online space now. Getting out of the way of all DL learners means getting out of the way of all learners.

I guess you can resign yourself to the role of perennial teacher, or just hide on LLORG.

I choose to hide

I'm on those groups to be a teacher. I stick around to give other people the help I got from web forums on my way up. However, I don't want to spend my entire life explaining the concept of noun gender every second day. It's not a productive use of my time, and the basic chat floods out the questions for improvers and intermediate learners that aren't already covered in every single course except Duolingo (which actually does include them in "tips" that no-one is ever pushed towards reading).

There are some accomplished language learners on this forum who have used Duolingo as a component of their language learning approach, and who have a different, more positive view of Duolingo.

As a computer scientist, I completely get what Duolingo is trying to do. I appreciate that it is good at what it does. However, what it does is very limited, and institutionally they have no will to acknowledge that and do their customers a disservice by not pointing out that they need to do other things.

Now the criticism is that it is somehow damaging to language learning, which with every respect seems a little frantic. Have the recent critics tried Duolingo recently? I know one of the posters here in this thread recently advised elsewhere that "I've never actually used it."

5111XP, 125 crowns, lost a 110* day streak 85 days ago. Been using it on and off for 8 years, having signed up less than 6 months after it first launched. So can I criticise it now?
[Edit: Hmmm.... I thought those numbers seemed low. Turns out that was just Welsh. 15468 XP 301 crowns total.]

* Not my highest ever streak -- that was before duome.eu and I can't remember how high I got. Certainly not as long as a year.