Six languages an educated person should know (Prof. Argüelles)

[einzelne]

Last night I watched an interview on Russian TV with US political commentator.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about Michael McFaul?

[bolaobo]

Again, I would love to see Argüelles speaking Korean. It looks like we don't have a single video online. I don't want to discredit him, far from it, but to state the objective fact — it's damn hard to maintain even a single language at a high level. That's why, honestly, the idea of six languages seems like utopian nonsense to me.

In his defense his wife is Korean and I know I've heard him say they'll use Korean when they don't want their kids to understand them, so it's not unbelievable that he gets some decent practice. I don't disagree with your point, though. I like his 6 language thing in theory but in reality--I've got many other things to do in life, and will probably stick to learning IE languages to the point where I can read books and travel.

He doesn't speak to his wife full-time in Korean? That's surprising to me. I assumed his Korean was better than her English.

[RyanSmallwood]

Again, I would love to see Argüelles speaking Korean. It looks like we don't have a single video online. I don't want to discredit him, far from it, but to state the objective fact — it's damn hard to maintain even a single language at a high level. That's why, honestly, the idea of six languages seems like utopian nonsense to me.

In his defense his wife is Korean and I know I've heard him say they'll use Korean when they don't want their kids to understand them, so it's not unbelievable that he gets some decent practice. I don't disagree with your point, though. I like his 6 language thing in theory but in reality--I've got many other things to do in life, and will probably stick to learning IE languages to the point where I can read books and travel.

He doesn't speak to his wife full-time in Korean? That's surprising to me. I assumed his Korean was better than her English.

I remember him saying in his video on raising multi-lingual children, that at some point she needed to improve her English quickly, so they switched to using mainly English to help her practice more, which is why his kids don't speak Korean, although I think they've been learning some languages on their own.

[einzelne]

If I remember correctly his kids went to a French speaking kindergarten.

"and at home I speak French with my sons, unless my Korean wife is there, in which case we'll use English. If we don't want the kids to understand everything we're saying, we use Korean."

[David1917]

Last night I watched an interview on Russian TV with US political commentator.

Just out of curiosity: are you talking about Michael McFaul?

Yes.

but if the guy also has a BA in Slavic Languages and an MA in Soviet Studies I think it is fair to expect him to have a decent level of Russian, especially if he agrees to appear on Russian television to discuss political issues (which I assume was what he was there for).

Yes.

I'm not trying to defend him but active skills require constant practice, especially when it comes to synthetic languages like Russian. How many years have passes since he left Russia?

Not many, and if he's an "expert" and university professor, he should be keeping up on it. Zero excuse.

Ambassadorship requires a whole set of skills. You can have perfect Russian but with zero diplomatic and organizational skills it is worth nothing. I remember a discussion on a Russian forum about the current Russian ambassador in the USA Anatoly Antonov. "OMG, I cannot believe that his accent is so thick!" — such was the most common complain. But you don't hire an ambassador simply because he has a native like accent.

No, and someone like Lavrov has quite an accent but speaks perfect English. It wasn't just the accent, it was also the stream of mistakes such that he had to be subtitled, and a very narrow lexicon (to match his very narrow worldview...)

I don't want this to deteriorate in the wrong direction, but based on his foul rhetoric, he has no ambassadorial or diplomatic skills.

[einzelne]

Yes.

Can you share the link? You can PM me if you want. Out of curiosity, I listened to Q&A with him on Ekho Moskvi. Yes, he has an accent but it doesn't impede my understanding (Argüelles' accent is much thicker for that matter). Yes, there were some sporadic mistakes in conjugation and inflection but, at least for me, it wasn't such a big deal. I didn't listen to the whole thing but it was a 30 min show. May be he simply had a bad day?

Just out of curiosity: do you have some examples of foreigners speaking excellent Russian according to your standards?

[IronMike]

Last night I watched an interview on Russian TV with US political commentator who was a) once the US Ambassador to Russia and b) currently a professor at Stanford [where he allegedly completed an MA in Soviet Studies on top of his BA in Slavic Languages]. I couldn't believe how utterly terrible his Russian was. Elementary grammar mistakes, abysmal pronunciation, minimal vocabulary, just a total trainwreck. That's the state of Russian "expertise" in the US apparently.

Because I'm a fair person, I will say that he at least was able to understand his interlocutors and respond accordingly. His responses were just impossible to understand (they had to subtitle him).

You could easily get an MA or even a PhD is Soviet (or Russian) Studies (as opposed to a graduate degree in Slavic Linguistics) without a "professional" level of Russian. Also, ambassadors don't have to have the language that they're assigned to (esp. politically appointed like who I think you're talking about, but even career foreign service officers don't have to have the language when they hold the rank of ambassador).

And finally, assuming you're talking about one of my former bosses Mike McFaul. Mike left the country almost 8 years ago after two years of repeated and extreme Russian government harassment. He probably hasn't had to speak much Russian since leaving, and who knows: getting that kind of treatment when you'd studied the country and perhaps was excited to serve there and get to experience living there...well, that can tarnish your feelings about the culture and people you used to like/admire/love. (Sorry, getting personal.)

If you want to listen to a former U.S. ambo to Russia with good Russian, search for John Beyrle. Know, however, that due to his father's unique history, he had a great interest in the language and did extensive study of the language (UMichigan and Middlebury) before he began his career, as well as specializing in it from the beginning of his diplomatic career.

Just my 2 kopeks...

[Faust]

Last night I watched an interview on Russian TV with US political commentator who was a) once the US Ambassador to Russia and b) currently a professor at Stanford [where he allegedly completed an MA in Soviet Studies on top of his BA in Slavic Languages]. I couldn't believe how utterly terrible his Russian was. Elementary grammar mistakes, abysmal pronunciation, minimal vocabulary, just a total trainwreck. That's the state of Russian "expertise" in the US apparently.

Because I'm a fair person, I will say that he at least was able to understand his interlocutors and respond accordingly. His responses were just impossible to understand (they had to subtitle him).

You could easily get an MA or even a PhD is Soviet (or Russian) Studies (as opposed to a graduate degree in Slavic Linguistics) without a "professional" level of Russian. Also, ambassadors don't have to have the language that they're assigned to (esp. politically appointed like who I think you're talking about, but even career foreign service officers don't have to have the language when they hold the rank of ambassador).

And finally, assuming you're talking about one of my former bosses Mike McFaul. Mike left the country almost 8 years ago after two years of repeated and extreme Russian government harassment. He probably hasn't had to speak much Russian since leaving, and who knows: getting that kind of treatment when you'd studied the country and perhaps was excited to serve there and get to experience living there...well, that can tarnish your feelings about the culture and people you used to like/admire/love. (Sorry, getting personal.)

If you want to listen to a former U.S. ambo to Russia with good Russian, search for John Beyrle. Know, however, that due to his father's unique history, he had a great interest in the language and did extensive study of the language (UMichigan and Middlebury) before he began his career, as well as specializing in it from the beginning of his diplomatic career.

Just my 2 kopeks...

Yes. It is also worth emphasizing he is not a language professor; he teaches International Relations/PoliSci courses.

If the guy did well enough to speak and respond to those he was engaging with without an interpreter, I'd call that pretty good.

[einzelne]

If you want to listen to a former U.S. ambo to Russia with good Russian, search for John Beyrle.

Here, for example.

As Mike McFaul, he explicitly told Ekho Moskvi, that he "forgot Russian language" since he hasn't been to Russia for 7 years. And, yes, all ambassadors after him apparently don't speak Russian at all. At least I couldn't find a single interview in Russian.

[IronMike]

If you want to listen to a former U.S. ambo to Russia with good Russian, search for John Beyrle.

Here, for example.

OMG, I love Pozner's interviews!