Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Solo español
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby Cavesa » Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:30 pm

I have problem running things through automatic translation but I realize I might not be part of the majority on this. I think English as the main language is not wrong, but we could do with more active other forums. I think we have a chance to do it this time, now that we are changing some of the htlal traditions. We just need to put in some effort at first, to get things running, I'd guess. For example, splitting the book club and movie club among the language specific subforums, as is already happening, may be a great start.
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby basica » Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:54 pm

I don't really have an issue if there's a dedicated forum, or people are allowed to post whatever language they want everywhere. As long as each thread stays consistent - i.e. a thread started in german has german responses and an english one has english responses. If I am curious as to what's going on I can use google translate like someone suggested (it's what I'd do anyway when I'm reading 1e4e6's log for example).

EDIT: and perhaps we ought to move this subsequent discussion into a separate thread?
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby arthaey » Wed Aug 05, 2015 1:04 am

I had suggested such an idea over on the Technical subforum, if you want to continue it there? http://how-to-learn-any-language.org/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=823
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby rdearman » Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:14 am

I have unlocked this topic because I would like to get some feedback about this particular experiment. Is it useful to have a dedicated area for a single language? Suggestions for improvements? I am throwing the door open for your opinions. What do you think? Is it worthwhile?
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby Spoonary » Sun Aug 23, 2015 11:32 am

I definitely think it is a good idea to have language-specific forums. That way if someone wants to discuss astrophysics in Swahili, they will have a place to do that (other than their log, of course). The only problem I can see is choosing which languages to create areas for. Of course, there will be the usual suspects, AKA FIGS (French, Italian, German, Spanish) and a handful of other popular languages, but what about those who study less popular languages? Perhaps there should be a system put in place to request a forum for a specific language, with a necessary minimum of 3(?) active learners/(native) speakers required... :?
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby emk » Sun Aug 23, 2015 11:47 am

Spoonary wrote:Perhaps there should be a system put in place to request a forum for a specific language, with a necessary minimum of 3(?) active learners/(native) speakers required... :?

Yeah, the historic problem with the language-specific subforums is that they're almost empty and dead. This nice thing about the current Spanish subforum is that it has a core group of users who are working hard to keep it alive.

This is not an official statement, merely an observation. :-)
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby mrwarper » Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:49 pm

rdearman wrote:I have unlocked this topic because I would like to get some feedback about this particular experiment. Is it useful to have a dedicated area for a single language? Suggestions for improvements? I am throwing the door open for your opinions. What do you think? Is it worthwhile?

As you may (or may not) know, I have my own separate yet somewhat related project concerning all of this, so I am very interested in seeing how this all works out. It is both worthwhile and interesting--at the very least we would learn what to expect for future alternate language subforums. Maybe it's a bad idea that will rule itself out. Let's have it and see how it evolves.

emk wrote:
Spoonary wrote:Perhaps there should be a system put in place to request a forum for a specific language, with a necessary minimum of 3(?) active learners/(native) speakers required... :?

Yeah, the historic problem with the language-specific subforums is that they're almost empty and dead. This nice thing about the current Spanish subforum is that it has a core group of users who are working hard to keep it alive.

While I don't see having such forums half-empty as a problem, maybe having a minimum group of solicitants (say three learners plus one native, or what you see fit) would be a good idea as to avoid spreading resources too thin.

Expugnator wrote:I'm not learning Spanish right now, but it would help if, for example, native speakers here at the Spanish subforum put their texts in italics. It would be easier for the trained eye to focus on the native content. I'd still read the posts of other learners, of course, but I would know where to base my learning on.

Now this is an approach I don't like at all to an idea I like a lot. I think nobody should be required to somehow format their posts for special purposes that could be automated, albeit I do not know with how much effort (oh the nightmare of coding plugins, extensions, or mods). So, let me propose a mechanism and let's see what you think.

Discussions in alternate subfora are supposed to be held in a particular language (this meta-thread being a one-off exception, I assume), right? Cool, then let the forum software check if that language is listed by users that partake in the thread as 'native language', or maybe C2, etc. (I think listing their languages in some standardized form is quite a reasonable request for forum users), and then mark their posts in the thread accordingly, i.e. give them a golden background akin to an authority aura, put them in italics, or whatever ; )

(Slightly reworded for clarity)
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby Montmorency » Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:26 pm

I think that's actually not a good use of italics. Italics are usually used to make something stand out, like this.

I actually have difficulty reading great expanses of italics. Maybe that's just me, but it's just somehow wrong.

If I was trying to read a language that wasn't my first language, and if it was all in italics, it would actually put me off trying to make the effort to understand it (at least if we are talking about paragraphs and paragraphs of writing).

If you wish to mark the post in some special way, fair enough. e.g. using some special symbol at the top, or some flag or icon or something. But I don't think changing the appearance or the nature of the whole text is a good idea (unless the author wants to present it in some special way for some special purpose, but that's not what we're talking about here, really).
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby s_allard » Tue Nov 24, 2015 12:08 pm

I wasn't sure where to put this and I didn't feel like starting a thread in Spanish but I might if people recommend it. I'm having doubts of the current subtitle of the thread:solo Español. It seems to me that it should be: sólo Español or better yet Sólo en español.
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Re: Highly Experimental Spanish Only Sub-Forum

Postby iguanamon » Tue Nov 24, 2015 12:20 pm

s_allard wrote:I'm having doubts of the current subtitle of the thread:solo Español. It seems to me that it should be: sólo Español or better yet Sólo en español.

The use of the accented "ó" is no longer necessary with solo as per the RAE:
RAE wrote:El adverbio solo y los pronombres demostrativos, sin tilde

La palabra solo, tanto cuando es adverbio y equivale a solamente (Solo llevaba un par de monedas en el bolsillo) como cuando es adjetivo (No me gusta estar solo), así como los demostrativos este, ese y aquel, con sus femeninos y plurales, funcionen como pronombres (Este es tonto; Quiero aquella) o como determinantes (aquellos tipos, la chica esa), no deben llevar tilde según las reglas generales de acentuación, bien por tratarse de palabras bisílabas llanas terminadas en vocal o en -s, bien, en el caso de aquel, por ser aguda y acabar en consonante distinta de n o s.

Aun así, las reglas ortográficas anteriores prescribían el uso de tilde diacrítica en el adverbio solo y los pronombres demostrativos para distinguirlos, respectivamente, del adjetivo solo y de los determinantes demostrativos, cuando en un mismo enunciado eran posibles ambas interpretaciones y podían producirse casos de ambigüedad, como en los ejemplos siguientes: Trabaja sólo los domingos [= ‘trabaja solamente los domingos’], para evitar su confusión con Trabaja solo los domingos [= ‘trabaja sin compañía los domingos’]; o ¿Por qué compraron aquéllos libros usados? (aquéllos es el sujeto de la oración), frente a ¿Por qué compraron aquellos libros usados? (el sujeto de esta oración no está expreso, y aquellos acompaña al sustantivo libros).

Sin embargo, ese empleo tradicional de la tilde en el adverbio solo y los pronombres demostrativos no cumple el requisito fundamental que justifica el uso de la tilde diacrítica, que es el de oponer palabras tónicas o acentuadas a palabras átonas o inacentuadas formalmente idénticas, ya que tanto solo como los demostrativos son siempre palabras tónicas en cualquiera de sus funciones. Por eso, a partir de ahora se podrá prescindir de la tilde en estas formas incluso en casos de ambigüedad. La recomendación general es, pues, la de no tildar nunca estas palabras. source
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