How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

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ibrahimovic
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How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby ibrahimovic » Thu Dec 08, 2016 11:53 pm

I recently acquired several Graded Learner with an accompanied audiobook for each of it. I specifically bought BlackCat/CIDEB collection as it is a cheaper option compared to Hueber's German Graded learner. After getting through a couple of the book, I notice I did not seem to retain much of it; vocabulary wise and also the sentence structure.

For people reading this, what different approach do you use to get the most of out it? Tips and strategies?
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Tomás
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby Tomás » Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:10 am

ibrahimovic wrote:I recently acquired several Graded Learner with an accompanied audiobook for each of it. I specifically bought BlackCat/CIDEB collection as it is a cheaper option compared to Hueber's German Graded learner. After getting through a couple of the book, I notice I did not seem to retain much of it; vocabulary wise and also the sentence structure.

For people reading this, what different approach do you use to get the most of out it? Tips and strategies?


I found the graded readers I used to be extremely boring. For me, they were a stepping stone to native materials. The sooner you can wean yourself off of readers the better.
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snowflake
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby snowflake » Fri Dec 09, 2016 1:12 am

ibrahimovic wrote: I notice I did not seem to retain much of it; vocabulary wise and also the sentence structure.


So far the only thing that seems to work for me is to chorus/shadow audio clips over an extended time period. Doing repetitive readings does not work the same for me. For various grammar structures that means creating audio as finding clips or finding enough clips can be difficult.

Good luck.
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby WalkingAlone13 » Fri Dec 09, 2016 5:00 pm

I both like and dislike graded readers. I used them for the first time with German, and going from a zero level to mid A levels, they worked reasonably well. However it was mostly just by reading through a chapter a day, once in the morning and once again later in the evening (same chapter). The readers I used only had two to three pages per chapter, as well as comprehension questions at the end. Sometimes I would not remember the answer to a question, so I would go back and skim read to find the answer. This added to the two times already reading through gave me a very high level of comprehension per chapter. Once I had done that with the whole book, I would just read through the whole book (or as much as possible) in a day, and did that for a few days until I could read it without looking anything up. Then I moved on to the next reader. I did this for the first three readers and it worked well.
After that, I did not really bother too much with other graded readers. It gave me a boost, which is good but readers are quite boring due to their nature.

In contrast, I reached the same level/probably better in Swedish by starting right away with teen reading with extensive reading. I read the first four books by Rob Kidd in the Jack Sparrow collection. I have much fonder memories of that than the graded readers.
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Speakeasy
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby Speakeasy » Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:28 pm

I Feel Your Pain
I have a large collection of German Graded Readers and I, too, found that the experience of working with these supplemental materials seemed to lack some undefinable element. Your post caused me to consider what might be wrong -- in my approach, in my expectations, or in the materials themselves – and, having thought about the matter, here are a few comments:

My Approach
Reading
Nothing original here, just the standard “three pass” approach. In the “first pass”, I would read through the entire text rather quickly, without stopping to ponder the words or phrases that I did not immediately grasp, with a view to developing a general appreciation of the story-line. In the “second pass”, I would read rather slowly, stopping at every word or phrase that caused the slightest difficulty underscoring the difficult parts ever-so-lightly with an HB5 pencil. I would pause my reading so as to review any unfamiliar words carefully both in a bilingual and in a unilingual dictionary. Then, I would write summary notes to a Post-It which I would append to the page in question and continue the process to the end of the Reader. In the “third pass”, I read the entire text at a moderate pace, concentrating rather heavily on meaning.
Listening
Having gained a good grasp of the story line, I would then devote my attention to the accompanying audio recording. My “first pass” would be to listen to the audio, without stopping, while attempting the visualize the text. My “second pass” would be to read the text while listening to the audio recording. I would make note of any audio passages that seemed difficult to understand. In the “third pass”, I would listen repeatedly to those portions of the audio that had caused me difficulties. Occasionally, I would “shadow” the audio. However, given the very nature of the readers themselves (they can be rather boring from the perspective of an adult), I often found this step too tedious. I would allow for time to pass – sometimes a couple of months -- before listening to the audio portion again, with a view to testing my comprehension.

The Materials Themselves
I have read fifty-plus German Graded Readers. The vast majority of them are graded as A1 or A2 level. There are a few available at the B1 level, but they are not numerous (with the exception of the collection offered by La Spiga). The grading is consistent within a given publisher’s collection; however, there exist major differences in grading of readers between the publishers. I was surprised to discover that the vocabulary deployed in the graded readers is a narrow and rather repetitive subset of that deployed in the course materials published by Langenscheidt, Hueber, Klett, McGraw-Hill, and their competitors for use in a classroom setting (once again, with the exception of the collection offered by La Spiga). Assuming that one is reasonably comfortable with German sentence structure as expressed at the A1 and A2 levels, this is not an issue in the Graded Readers; that is, it is neither stressed nor does it pose a problem.

My Learning Experience: The “Railway-Siding” Syndrome
The Proof is in the Pudding

While I do not think that there was anything significantly wrong with my approach, I am open to suggestions on improving it. Nevertheless, I would offer that “there was evidence of improvement” in that, several months hence, I could pick up any of the fifty-odd Graded Readers and read through them quickly, without difficulty. Furthermore, I could listen to the audio recordings with full comprehension.
But What Did It “Feel Like?”
Well, it “felt like” I had “not really” improved my German at all! That is (and I realize that this is going to sound very odd), having read and laboured over fifty-plus German Graded Readers in in “binge” fashion, I was left with the feeling that I had merely improved my ability in reading A1 and A2 level German Graded Readers, BUT THAT, OWING TO THE LIMITED VOCABULARY DEPLOYED IN THE READERS, THIS LEVEL OF SKILL WAS NOT TRANSFERABLE. To put it another way, it “felt like” my learning had been shunted off to a railway-siding where my progress stagnated (despite what I just wrote about “evidence of improvement”). I wonder if other independent language learners have experienced a similar sensation?

Conclusions and Recommendations: meiner Meinung nach!
First, lower your expectations. A1-A2 level Graded Readers represent a limited opportunity for the reinforcement of only a subset of what you have been studying. However, they are not a reliable vehicle for helping one progress to the Intermediate Level in German (I could offer suggestions on how to approach this subject, but doing so would represent a serious digression from the matter under discussion). Second, since Graded Readers deploy what-seems-to-be a rather standardized subset of the vocabulary that is introduced in classroom course books, be aware that the benefits of reading a small collection of readers are not likely to be enhanced by reading a substantially larger collection. Third, if you are reasonably satisfied with the results that you have achieved through your own approach, simply ignore the one that I adopted. Fourth, at the very least, take heart in knowing that other independent language-learners have experienced similar disappointment vis-à-vis their initial expectations. Fifth, maintain your collection of Graded Readers in the best condition possible and, when you are finished with them, bundle them together and offer them as a collection on EBay for about half their original price. Sixth, keep moving forward!
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Tomás
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby Tomás » Sat Dec 10, 2016 11:35 pm

Speakeasy wrote:My Learning Experience: The “Railway-Siding” Syndrome
The Proof is in the Pudding

While I do not think that there was anything significantly wrong with my approach, I am open to suggestions on improving it. Nevertheless, I would offer that “there was evidence of improvement” in that, several months hence, I could pick up any of the fifty-odd Graded Readers and read through them quickly, without difficulty. Furthermore, I could listen to the audio recordings with full comprehension.
But What Did It “Feel Like?”
Well, it “felt like” I had “not really” improved my German at all! That is (and I realize that this is going to sound very odd), having read and laboured over fifty-plus German Graded Readers in in “binge” fashion, I was left with the feeling that I had merely improved my ability in reading A1 and A2 level German Graded Readers, BUT THAT, OWING TO THE LIMITED VOCABULARY DEPLOYED IN THE READERS, THIS LEVEL OF SKILL WAS NOT TRANSFERABLE. To put it another way, it “felt like” my learning had been shunted off to a railway-siding where my progress stagnated (despite what I just wrote about “evidence of improvement”). I wonder if other independent language learners have experienced a similar sensation?

Conclusions and Recommendations: meiner Meinung nach!
First, lower your expectations. A1-A2 level Graded Readers represent a limited opportunity for the reinforcement of only a subset of what you have been studying. However, they are not a reliable vehicle for helping one progress to the Intermediate Level in German (I could offer suggestions on how to approach this subject, but doing so would represent a serious digression from the matter under discussion). Second, since Graded Readers deploy what-seems-to-be a rather standardized subset of the vocabulary that is introduced in classroom course books, be aware that the benefits of reading a small collection of readers are not likely to be enhanced by reading a substantially larger collection. Third, if you are reasonably satisfied with the results that you have achieved through your own approach, simply ignore the one that I adopted. Fourth, at the very least, take heart in knowing that other independent language-learners have experienced similar disappointment vis-à-vis their initial expectations. Fifth, maintain your collection of Graded Readers in the best condition possible and, when you are finished with them, bundle them together and offer them as a collection on EBay for about half their original price. Sixth, keep moving forward!


Interesting observations! They suggest to me that readers are good for raw beginners to start L-R, and building confidence, but perhaps something to wean from asap.
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Speakeasy
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby Speakeasy » Sun Dec 11, 2016 12:24 am

Tomás wrote: ...They suggest to me that readers are good for raw beginners to start L-R, and building confidence, but perhaps something to wean from asap.
Yes, I would support such a conclusion.

There exist "collections of readings" at the Intermediate and Advanced levels that represent an interesting opportunity for assisting serious students advance their reading skills; however, I would consider these stand-alone works as being in a category quite separate from that of Graded Readers.
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ibrahimovic
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby ibrahimovic » Sun Dec 11, 2016 3:14 am

Speakeasy wrote:I Feel Your Pain
I have a large collection of German Graded Readers and I, too, found that the experience of working with these supplemental materials seemed to lack some undefinable element. Your post caused me to consider what might be wrong -- in my approach, in my expectations, or in the materials themselves – and, having thought about the matter, here are a few comments:

My Approach
Reading
Nothing original here, just the standard “three pass” approach. In the “first pass”, I would read through the entire text rather quickly, without stopping to ponder the words or phrases that I did not immediately grasp, with a view to developing a general appreciation of the story-line. In the “second pass”, I would read rather slowly, stopping at every word or phrase that caused the slightest difficulty underscoring the difficult parts ever-so-lightly with an HB5 pencil. I would pause my reading so as to review any unfamiliar words carefully both in a bilingual and in a unilingual dictionary. Then, I would write summary notes to a Post-It which I would append to the page in question and continue the process to the end of the Reader. In the “third pass”, I read the entire text at a moderate pace, concentrating rather heavily on meaning.
Listening
Having gained a good grasp of the story line, I would then devote my attention to the accompanying audio recording. My “first pass” would be to listen to the audio, without stopping, while attempting the visualize the text. My “second pass” would be to read the text while listening to the audio recording. I would make note of any audio passages that seemed difficult to understand. In the “third pass”, I would listen repeatedly to those portions of the audio that had caused me difficulties. Occasionally, I would “shadow” the audio. However, given the very nature of the readers themselves (they can be rather boring from the perspective of an adult), I often found this step too tedious. I would allow for time to pass – sometimes a couple of months -- before listening to the audio portion again, with a view to testing my comprehension.

The Materials Themselves
I have read fifty-plus German Graded Readers. The vast majority of them are graded as A1 or A2 level. There are a few available at the B1 level, but they are not numerous (with the exception of the collection offered by La Spiga). The grading is consistent within a given publisher’s collection; however, there exist major differences in grading of readers between the publishers. I was surprised to discover that the vocabulary deployed in the graded readers is a narrow and rather repetitive subset of that deployed in the course materials published by Langenscheidt, Hueber, Klett, McGraw-Hill, and their competitors for use in a classroom setting (once again, with the exception of the collection offered by La Spiga). Assuming that one is reasonably comfortable with German sentence structure as expressed at the A1 and A2 levels, this is not an issue in the Graded Readers; that is, it is neither stressed nor does it pose a problem.

My Learning Experience: The “Railway-Siding” Syndrome
The Proof is in the Pudding

While I do not think that there was anything significantly wrong with my approach, I am open to suggestions on improving it. Nevertheless, I would offer that “there was evidence of improvement” in that, several months hence, I could pick up any of the fifty-odd Graded Readers and read through them quickly, without difficulty. Furthermore, I could listen to the audio recordings with full comprehension.
But What Did It “Feel Like?”
Well, it “felt like” I had “not really” improved my German at all! That is (and I realize that this is going to sound very odd), having read and laboured over fifty-plus German Graded Readers in in “binge” fashion, I was left with the feeling that I had merely improved my ability in reading A1 and A2 level German Graded Readers, BUT THAT, OWING TO THE LIMITED VOCABULARY DEPLOYED IN THE READERS, THIS LEVEL OF SKILL WAS NOT TRANSFERABLE. To put it another way, it “felt like” my learning had been shunted off to a railway-siding where my progress stagnated (despite what I just wrote about “evidence of improvement”). I wonder if other independent language learners have experienced a similar sensation?

Conclusions and Recommendations: meiner Meinung nach!
First, lower your expectations. A1-A2 level Graded Readers represent a limited opportunity for the reinforcement of only a subset of what you have been studying. However, they are not a reliable vehicle for helping one progress to the Intermediate Level in German (I could offer suggestions on how to approach this subject, but doing so would represent a serious digression from the matter under discussion). Second, since Graded Readers deploy what-seems-to-be a rather standardized subset of the vocabulary that is introduced in classroom course books, be aware that the benefits of reading a small collection of readers are not likely to be enhanced by reading a substantially larger collection. Third, if you are reasonably satisfied with the results that you have achieved through your own approach, simply ignore the one that I adopted. Fourth, at the very least, take heart in knowing that other independent language-learners have experienced similar disappointment vis-à-vis their initial expectations. Fifth, maintain your collection of Graded Readers in the best condition possible and, when you are finished with them, bundle them together and offer them as a collection on EBay for about half their original price. Sixth, keep moving forward!


Thank you all for your advices. After finishing my trip to Germany last week, it's hard to pick up German again but I'm trying my best for perhaps my next trip in 2-3 years time. I'm enjoying learning it so it will be my goal to get to B2 before stopping it. Especially when I can only say basic sentences even after the long Assimol, TY and Glossika course.

Thanks Speakeasy for your sharing your experience! I think I might have to limit the graded books to 3-4 per CEFR level. As you said, at the end of the 80 books, it is just as some sort of assessment but not to improve anything more than that.

Graded learner might be a bit overated but it can be helpful for the progress. As for now, transition after Assimil and LL is hard and the journey to B1 seem extremely laborious for self learner.
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iAnonGuy
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby iAnonGuy » Sat Dec 24, 2016 3:43 am

Tomás wrote:
ibrahimovic wrote:I recently acquired several Graded Learner with an accompanied audiobook for each of it. I specifically bought BlackCat/CIDEB collection as it is a cheaper option compared to Hueber's German Graded learner. After getting through a couple of the book, I notice I did not seem to retain much of it; vocabulary wise and also the sentence structure.

For people reading this, what different approach do you use to get the most of out it? Tips and strategies?


I found the graded readers I used to be extremely boring. For me, they were a stepping stone to native materials. The sooner you can wean yourself off of readers the better.

I don't agree. If you're completely oblivious of how to actually use a reader for active study, then you won't get much out of it. If you just read it while checking "do I understand this," then you won't get much benefit out of it.

Graded readers are no different than the dialogs in a language course. You don't simply look at the dialog, read it, and say "okay, I'll look up these words." It takes much more active study to actually gain benefit from them.

I also think that it's best to use them in concert with the audiobook as well.

1. Skim the relevant section to see what kind of language is used in it.
2. Listen to the Audiobook without reading the book to see what you recognize/understand.
3. Read the section while listening to the audiobook.
4. Read the section - aloud - while listening to the audiobook. This will check your pronunciation and intonation, as well as uncover any problem sounds/words (mark them).
5. Note the words you don't understand, but don't look them up until you're done with #4. Try to figure things out through context.
6. After looking them up. Read aloud with the audiobook again to patch up the holes.

I typically only do a section at a time: as in a few paragraphs.

The graded readers are used to learn and assimilate base vocabulary. Unless your level is above that which the reader is written for, you won't learn much from it if you rush through it. A 200 pg. graded reader is like a month+ of intensive study.

If you know how to use them, definitely use them. If you don't, they just stick to cramming vocabulary in Anki.

The funny thing about Assimil is that it's basically nothing more than a Graded reader with grammar points sprinkled in here and there. You use both of them in basically the same way. I find a reader without audio close to worthless unless they are for Intermediate+ level.
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iAnonGuy
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Re: How to get the most out of a Graded Learner book?

Postby iAnonGuy » Sat Dec 24, 2016 3:45 am

ibrahimovic wrote:
Speakeasy wrote:I Feel Your Pain
I have a large collection of German Graded Readers and I, too, found that the experience of working with these supplemental materials seemed to lack some undefinable element. Your post caused me to consider what might be wrong -- in my approach, in my expectations, or in the materials themselves – and, having thought about the matter, here are a few comments:

My Approach
Reading
Nothing original here, just the standard “three pass” approach. In the “first pass”, I would read through the entire text rather quickly, without stopping to ponder the words or phrases that I did not immediately grasp, with a view to developing a general appreciation of the story-line. In the “second pass”, I would read rather slowly, stopping at every word or phrase that caused the slightest difficulty underscoring the difficult parts ever-so-lightly with an HB5 pencil. I would pause my reading so as to review any unfamiliar words carefully both in a bilingual and in a unilingual dictionary. Then, I would write summary notes to a Post-It which I would append to the page in question and continue the process to the end of the Reader. In the “third pass”, I read the entire text at a moderate pace, concentrating rather heavily on meaning.
Listening
Having gained a good grasp of the story line, I would then devote my attention to the accompanying audio recording. My “first pass” would be to listen to the audio, without stopping, while attempting the visualize the text. My “second pass” would be to read the text while listening to the audio recording. I would make note of any audio passages that seemed difficult to understand. In the “third pass”, I would listen repeatedly to those portions of the audio that had caused me difficulties. Occasionally, I would “shadow” the audio. However, given the very nature of the readers themselves (they can be rather boring from the perspective of an adult), I often found this step too tedious. I would allow for time to pass – sometimes a couple of months -- before listening to the audio portion again, with a view to testing my comprehension.

The Materials Themselves
I have read fifty-plus German Graded Readers. The vast majority of them are graded as A1 or A2 level. There are a few available at the B1 level, but they are not numerous (with the exception of the collection offered by La Spiga). The grading is consistent within a given publisher’s collection; however, there exist major differences in grading of readers between the publishers. I was surprised to discover that the vocabulary deployed in the graded readers is a narrow and rather repetitive subset of that deployed in the course materials published by Langenscheidt, Hueber, Klett, McGraw-Hill, and their competitors for use in a classroom setting (once again, with the exception of the collection offered by La Spiga). Assuming that one is reasonably comfortable with German sentence structure as expressed at the A1 and A2 levels, this is not an issue in the Graded Readers; that is, it is neither stressed nor does it pose a problem.

My Learning Experience: The “Railway-Siding” Syndrome
The Proof is in the Pudding

While I do not think that there was anything significantly wrong with my approach, I am open to suggestions on improving it. Nevertheless, I would offer that “there was evidence of improvement” in that, several months hence, I could pick up any of the fifty-odd Graded Readers and read through them quickly, without difficulty. Furthermore, I could listen to the audio recordings with full comprehension.
But What Did It “Feel Like?”
Well, it “felt like” I had “not really” improved my German at all! That is (and I realize that this is going to sound very odd), having read and laboured over fifty-plus German Graded Readers in in “binge” fashion, I was left with the feeling that I had merely improved my ability in reading A1 and A2 level German Graded Readers, BUT THAT, OWING TO THE LIMITED VOCABULARY DEPLOYED IN THE READERS, THIS LEVEL OF SKILL WAS NOT TRANSFERABLE. To put it another way, it “felt like” my learning had been shunted off to a railway-siding where my progress stagnated (despite what I just wrote about “evidence of improvement”). I wonder if other independent language learners have experienced a similar sensation?

Conclusions and Recommendations: meiner Meinung nach!
First, lower your expectations. A1-A2 level Graded Readers represent a limited opportunity for the reinforcement of only a subset of what you have been studying. However, they are not a reliable vehicle for helping one progress to the Intermediate Level in German (I could offer suggestions on how to approach this subject, but doing so would represent a serious digression from the matter under discussion). Second, since Graded Readers deploy what-seems-to-be a rather standardized subset of the vocabulary that is introduced in classroom course books, be aware that the benefits of reading a small collection of readers are not likely to be enhanced by reading a substantially larger collection. Third, if you are reasonably satisfied with the results that you have achieved through your own approach, simply ignore the one that I adopted. Fourth, at the very least, take heart in knowing that other independent language-learners have experienced similar disappointment vis-à-vis their initial expectations. Fifth, maintain your collection of Graded Readers in the best condition possible and, when you are finished with them, bundle them together and offer them as a collection on EBay for about half their original price. Sixth, keep moving forward!


Thank you all for your advices. After finishing my trip to Germany last week, it's hard to pick up German again but I'm trying my best for perhaps my next trip in 2-3 years time. I'm enjoying learning it so it will be my goal to get to B2 before stopping it. Especially when I can only say basic sentences even after the long Assimol, TY and Glossika course.

Thanks Speakeasy for your sharing your experience! I think I might have to limit the graded books to 3-4 per CEFR level. As you said, at the end of the 80 books, it is just as some sort of assessment but not to improve anything more than that.

Graded learner might be a bit overated but it can be helpful for the progress. As for now, transition after Assimil and LL is hard and the journey to B1 seem extremely laborious for self learner.

If Assimil has a "Using" course for German, it might be better for you to move to that.
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