Re: PM’s French Re-entry into the Matrix - Phase 1: 500 Hours Extensive Reading

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Xmmm
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby Xmmm » Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:19 pm

PeterMollenburg wrote:
rlnv wrote:Have you ever estimated how much time you will need to do the 40 remaining courses, based on what you know about your pace in the past?

I'm curious because when I apply an estimate of those courses to my own pace, I come up with a finish date at some point in the next millennium. 40c * ((rlnv * dog slow) / rare speed bursts of inspiration and determination) = ~3032


Hey rlnv!
I have attempted in an extremely rough roundabout way, and have concluded that even 5 or 10 courses is almost too much! Ahhh what to do when one is me *sigh*


I don't see how you will ever be able to feel like your mission is complete if you don't even do the DLI course. I think you need to put that one back on the list! ;)
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby Ani » Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:25 pm

Xmmm wrote:
I don't see how you will ever be able to feel like your mission is complete if you don't even do the DLI course. I think you need to put that one back on the list! ;)



pffft! You are not helping here! Last year, PM was just on a 4-5 course mission, which had some problem. I can't remember what. So he added back on 99 courses :-p
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby whatiftheblog » Tue Mar 07, 2017 11:34 pm

Not sure if you're looking for feedback here, so take this for whatever it's worth as it's more thoughts "aloud", but between this log and your other thread about progressing to C1, I'm not sure why you're still keeping beginners' books in your course rotation. Following up on what you'd posted in the C1 thread, I think your instinct to go towards native material is spot on for precisely the reason you stated: that it is significantly easier to absorb vast amounts of language through interacting with it in the (virtual) wild than through courses, specifically at your level.

By way of example, take the subjunctive: courses usually include long lists of words and expressions after which it is typically used, they'll run you through a thousand drills, they'll explain that it's a reflection of lack of certainty and the entire philosophy behind it, because of course it has a philosophy behind it, it's French... etc etc. Unless you learn all of this - plus all the correct forms of literally all the verbs - you'll either be stuck wondering "was that verb on that list or am I confusing it with some other list?" or analyzing the precise degree to which you are certain of something and whether that would count in French. Yet once you've spent even a relatively insignificant amount of time with native material, you will have already come across some form of "je veux que tu saches" a hundred times, and bam, that's now become automatic. You might not get a whole lot of imparfait du subjonctif, but that's not in your beginner courses, either.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that the material that makes up beginners' courses is classified as being beginner-level for a reason - it's a snapshot of the most commonly used vocabulary and grammar structures. If you still feel uneasy about it, reabsorbing that through native material, with all the collateral benefits that entails, seems to be a better use of time.
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby PeterMollenburg » Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:16 am

Xmmm wrote:I don't see how you will ever be able to feel like your mission is complete if you don't even do the DLI course. I think you need to put that one back on the list! ;)


You pesky teaser you! I'm cool with ditching it 8-)

Ani wrote:
Xmmm wrote:
I don't see how you will ever be able to feel like your mission is complete if you don't even do the DLI course. I think you need to put that one back on the list! ;)



pffft! You are not helping here! Last year, PM was just on a 4-5 course mission, which had some problem. I can't remember what. So he added back on 99 courses :-p


Indeed there was a problem. I was doing too many courses! And that was 5!!!!! (one exlamation mark per course- I know how to use exclamation marks, I did 56 courses on them, still quite a few to go).

I am constantly changing plans, i'm utterly rediculous!
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PeterMollenburg
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby PeterMollenburg » Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:22 am

whatiftheblog wrote:Not sure if you're looking for feedback here, so take this for whatever it's worth as it's more thoughts "aloud", but between this log and your other thread about progressing to C1, I'm not sure why you're still keeping beginners' books in your course rotation. Following up on what you'd posted in the C1 thread, I think your instinct to go towards native material is spot on for precisely the reason you stated: that it is significantly easier to absorb vast amounts of language through interacting with it in the (virtual) wild than through courses, specifically at your level.

By way of example, take the subjunctive: courses usually include long lists of words and expressions after which it is typically used, they'll run you through a thousand drills, they'll explain that it's a reflection of lack of certainty and the entire philosophy behind it, because of course it has a philosophy behind it, it's French... etc etc. Unless you learn all of this - plus all the correct forms of literally all the verbs - you'll either be stuck wondering "was that verb on that list or am I confusing it with some other list?" or analyzing the precise degree to which you are certain of something and whether that would count in French. Yet once you've spent even a relatively insignificant amount of time with native material, you will have already come across some form of "je veux que tu saches" a hundred times, and bam, that's now become automatic. You might not get a whole lot of imparfait du subjonctif, but that's not in your beginner courses, either.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that the material that makes up beginners' courses is classified as being beginner-level for a reason - it's a snapshot of the most commonly used vocabulary and grammar structures. If you still feel uneasy about it, reabsorbing that through native material, with all the collateral benefits that entails, seems to be a better use of time.


I agree, with everything you say here.

The issue is that I love makig my way through courses, which in all honesty have brought me a long way, as it's been my principal activity, but I need native content as is obvious.

Thus I need to resolve this. I have already cut out many of the courses from my list. I won't cut more just yet- over 30 is a good start. I swing from native to courses, to native content and back again always fighing the two sides. Thus I just need to find peace and work towards rotating the two- one hour courses, one hour native etc or at least something similar. It might not be the most efficient manner in which to progress, but at the moment it seems like the only logical one with all things considered.
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby PeterMollenburg » Wed Mar 08, 2017 8:44 am

I've added 2 couses back!

•Bien-dire : Guide de prononciation
•Bien-dire : Bon appétit (A2-B1)

I paid for these, they are short, won't take long to knock them over I feel.

•DLI- GLOSS has been removed. I don't 'own' it. It's done online, and from Serpent's explanations, sounds extremely useful. However it doesn't need to be on my list, as I can seek it out whenever I feel.
-----------------------------------------

Took my daughter to the French play group today again. A smaller group made up of all girls (no rough boys- boys are fine though in general) with one pretty much bilingual girl very keen to answer and interact, which I feel is a good influence on my daughter. Her mother is a non-native French speaker with a slight accent married to an English only speaking husband. Interestingly the other two girls speak languages other than French and English at home (Greek and Chinese). A nice little group I think. It can't hurt my daughter to be exposed to more French, from a native speaker (teacher) and be among other chilren similar to her. 't was a nice outing.
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby PeterMollenburg » Wed Mar 08, 2017 11:34 am

Ok, now that my course list feels right, time for me to take a break from the forum for a while. I shall report back in due course. Keep up your French learning peoples, time to stop fluffing about and start doing some courses or 40!
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby tastyonions » Wed Mar 08, 2017 11:51 am

Man, this thread is a great example of diversity in learning preferences. After one or (max) two courses in a language I never want to touch a coursebook again. But whatever keeps your interest up!
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby tomgosse » Wed Mar 08, 2017 4:39 pm

PeterMollenburg wrote:Ok, now that my course list feels right, time for me to take a break from the forum for a while. I shall report back in due course. Keep up your French learning peoples, time to stop fluffing about and start doing some courses or 40!

I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors!
Bon courage !
Tom
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Re: PM's French Courses Mission

Postby jeffers » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:03 pm

It was interesting to have a look over the last 6-7 pages of this thread after a long absence. I think you're doing the right thing by paring your course list back a bit, but in general it's nice to see that you're maintaining your goals and focus. "Plus ça change..."
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