Bex's Spanish log 2016/17

[Bex]

Wow iguanamon thanks so much. Lots to look at and ponder over.

I am really looking forward to this next phase of learning and also a little apprehensive. I am hoping I can find resources I enjoy and with all the advice I so kindly receive here hopefully I won't stray too far off course.

[Bex]

Whoa! Just looked on italki for a tutor!

Where do you start there are hundreds of them- not sure if I need a Professional Teacher or a Community Tutor? Although I am thinking Community Tutor since I only want to practice speaking. It is bad enough having to throw myself in at the deep end like this without having to randomly pick a tutor - feels like it will just be pot luck.

Does anyone have any recommendations for tutors * (not just on italki) - preferably teaching Spanish from Spain? It would be really, really appreciated.

*Please do PM if you'd rather not recommend in public

[Bex]

Today's mullings.....

It can be a bit of a daunting task because there's nobody there to hold your hand and guide you, like your course has done. I've seen this before with learners in a similar situation. What you do after Assimil is critical for your Spanish skills.

Well thanks to the extremely helpful and thought provoking post from iguanamon I have been considering what I should do once I finish Assimil and my progress so far and I thought it would be helpful for me to note all my ideas here so I can mull them over whilst I finish my Assimil course......

So far thoughts/progress…………..
Assimil nearly finished. Active wave stopped at lesson 36 (too difficult). Active wave is hard but need to keep on with it as it is good to do a little output each day, so I will restart back at lesson 8 and do another second wave, I have noted which lessons I found easy on the second wave and so will not repeat those.
Glossika is boring and have to force to do 1 lesson a day but it is improving my speech speed and my listening must be getting better because it doesn't sound even vaguely fast anymore, I should make more of an effort and do more of this. I would like to finish level 1 before the end of the year.
Duolingo finished!!
Language Transfer is nearly finished on 71/90 - would like to finish before the end of the year.

Basically my short-term goal is to complete all my progress bars by the end of the year.

Vague plan/ideas at this precise moment (am still revising this daily )…...........
Listening - Replace Assimil passive wave with something maybe a podcastsinspanish.org/ (I would like any resources I use to focus on spoken and not written Spanish) Also try not to use transcript unless absolutely necessary, as I have tendency to rely on the written and I have to stop doing that.
Writing - Go back and keep doing active wave from either Assimil book.
Speaking - Keep doing Glossika GSR 1 new & 1 review each day - more if possible.
Speaking - Get a tutor!!!!!!!!!
Reading - Readlang - possibly 30 mins a day? I'm not much of a reader and so this is gonna be difficult for me to maintain. Maybe I will use veintemundos as suggested by iguanamon, I may find that more enjoyable.

Considering (may add to plan/ditch/put on hold for now)……
FSI Basic Spanish drills but not sure if I want to combine with Glossika at the moment.
Verb practice/Grammer books, I have a few of these in progress might be a good idea to finish some of them!
SRS of some type Anki or MosaLingua. I try to do these because I know it will help with vocabulary but I never stick with them.
Cartoons - intensive studying. Should be good for listening comprehension.
Go back and review saysomethingin.com. Finished both Spanish levels back in April, might be a good time to review now.
Keep listening to Assimil audio only in spare time, now that I know the material pretty well? Shadow?
Lang-8 corrections - will be very useful to replace the Active wave once I have finished with it, again thanks iguanamon.

Thoughts………

Spanish needs to become part of your daily life in some way that is useful to you.

That one sentence sums up my biggest challenge with regards to finding what to do after Assimil but hopefully now having written down all my ideas, I can consider all my options and come up with a plan!

[westminstress]

Hmmmm as I moved on from courses I have found a range of regular input to be helpful. Especially listening. Podcasts are great if you can get into them. I recommend listening to a regular newscast in Spanish (I am in the U.S. and like the Voice of America newscast, but I think there are BBC, NHK and I'm sure broadcasts from Spain as well). Advantages of regularly listening to the news are: the newscasters themselves speak very clearly and are relatively easy to understand; but the "man on the street" interviews will expose you to different accents. For example, the VOA news has a segment on Latin American news every day, where they bring news from Venezuela, Argentina, Ecuador, Mexico, Chile other countries as issues pop up -- lots of different speakers in these segments. The news stories are rather like a soap opera in that they continue from day to day (though surprising events do happen from time to time) so the vocabulary repeats. Even if it's hard to understand at first, over time you will grow accustomed to the broadcast and will be able to listen to it almost like your native language.

In addition to that, try to find good quality podcasts on topics you like (personally I love Radio Ambulente, but there are so many shows). Watching Spanish TV or movies is good too. Find ones that have closed captioning or Spanish subtitles so that you can read as you listen. That really boosts comprehension. I don't do this much anymore but at an earlier stage I found it helpful to watch every episode multiple times, first with subtitles so that I could learn unknown words, and then without. That really helps to train your ear.

I think reading is helpful too. If there is any kind of thing you can tolerate reading in your native language, I would try to read that same kind of thing in Spanish.

Finally, speaking. I think this is a really good thing to do. I have trouble with this because I have a major time crunch. Even though I usually can't work on it directly, I have found that my speaking slowly does improve as my general confidence/ability improves - and that is a matter of improving my listening comprehension, increasing my vocabulary and gaining a better understanding of grammar.

[iguanamon]

I totally agree with westminstress. You need to move on with a good mix of native materials and some more study. It won't hurt you to go through Assimil again. Just remember that Assimil audio is slower and clearer than real world Spanish.

One of the traps I have seen some learners at the intermediate stage fall into is going to either one extreme or the other with native materials- either way too much course and learner-designed material, or the other end of the spectrum- way too much native material with little to no context. Now is the time to refine your grammar usage (formal study), your speaking, training listening by using a transcript and reading widely. Fortunately for Spanish, there are plenty of materials out there to help you do just that, if you'll use them. You can train both listening and reading widely with VeinteMundos and/or the news with a transcript (NHK World Spanish; Democracy Now! en Español and Amnistia Internacional podacast). I find for me, that grammar is best trained by seeing real-world examples and relating my formal study to it- noticing and studying. You can't notice much if you aren't reading and listening widely or trying to speak with native-speakers. Of course all of this depends on what you want to use Spanish for in your life. If you want to be an "all-rounder" then you need to practice all the skills. If you just want to consume media, then not so much.

Also, I know you want to concentrate on Iberian Spanish. I concentrated on Latin American Spanish when I learned it pre-internet. I assiduously avoided anything from Spain. Then, I moved to the UK and went to Spain for a month. I was shocked to be struggling to understand what I was hearing for about a week when people spoke to me. It was right then and there that I made an effort to become more familiar with Iberian Spanish and I'm very glad that I did. Cutting yourself off from LA Spanish means you will be denying yourself 300 million Spanish-speakers and their cultures. Also, probably up to around 10% of the population in Spain is composed of Latin American immigrants and their families. You will indeed hear Latin American Spanish in Spain, more often than you might think.

When I learned Portuguese, I didn't make the same mistake I did with Spanish. I made an effort to expose myself to Iberian and African Portuguese early on and continue to do so, despite my focus on Brazilian Portuguese. It's well worth the effort.

I'll leave you with this story. Once, when I was living in Liverpool, my wife rented a room to a French guy who was doing some kind of exchange with a school. He was in Liverpool (yeah, I know like, ) to improve his English. He had studied English in France with an overwhelmingly British focus. He watched British films. He listened to British music- He loved "Blur". He claimed he couldn't understand me and had to get my English wife to repeat whatever I said because I was an American. He was shocked when he turned on British TV to see that a lot of it came from the US. He couldn't understand the Scouse accent at all, nor Yorkshire, nor Scots, nor Irish accents. He eventually got used to Scouse and American accents after a few months, but it was painful to watch him struggling so much. Just a word of advice.

Links for audio with transcript:
Amnistía Internacional (España)
Podcast semanal sobre derechos humanos
Democracy Now! en Español
US focus news translated from English (left of center bias) with an accurate transcript in both Spanish and English
(not Assimil speed ) weekday 15 minute broadcast with a 30 minute week in review with transcript, plus translated opinion pieces with a transcript too.
NHK World Noticias
News in Spanish (native speakers) with a Japanese focus of course. Click on main story then follow each one individually for transcript.
Radio Ambulante
An interesting podcast with topical stories from across Latin America- with a transcript and an English translation
VeinteMundos
A learner designed text and audio "magazine" with 10 minute stories from all over the Spanish-speaking world; free downloadable pdf's and mp3. Satisfies both wide variety of reading and listening; options for both LA and Iberian Spanish audio- vastly under-utilized resource geared towards intermediate learners like you.
My post on how to train listening to Spanish
Using GlobalVoices.org to make simple (free) parallel texts
The New York Times en Español
Translated and original articles in Spanish (News and topical analysis) with a link to the English version.

Of course, using transcripts and parallel texts is a bridge to reading and to listening without them, but they will help you to get there.

[Bex]

I totally agree with westminstress. You need to move on with a good mix of native materials and some more study. It won't hurt you to go through Assimil again. Just remember that Assimil audio is slower and clearer than real world Spanish.

I think with this in mind I will only use the Assimil as a way to practice writing sentences each day, so I'll use my Active wave kinda in the same way as submitting sentences to Lang-8. I think this will be a good way for me to make sure I do a little writing every day and I can use the book to correct any mistakes I am making. And once I have finished with the books I can move onto Lang-8.

One of the traps I have seen some learners at the intermediate stage fall into is going to either one extreme or the other with native materials- either way too much course and learner-designed material, or the other end of the spectrum- way too much native material with little to no context.

I have been warned!

You can train both listening and reading widely with VeinteMundos

Looks like the one for me, now just to find a way to use these native materials, not something I'm very well practices at.

Also, I know you want to concentrate on Iberian Spanish. I concentrated on Latin American Spanish when I learned it pre-internet. I assiduously avoided anything from Spain. Then, I moved to the UK and went to Spain for a month. I was shocked to be struggling to understand what I was hearing for about a week when people spoke to me. It was right then and there that I made an effort to become more familiar with Iberian Spanish and I'm very glad that I did. Cutting yourself off from LA Spanish means you will be denying yourself 300 million Spanish-speakers and their cultures. Also, probably up to around 10% of the population in Spain is composed of Latin American immigrants and their families. You will indeed hear Latin American Spanish in Spain, more often than you might think.

I agree with everything you have said however now might be a good time to admit that I actually live in Spain

He was in Liverpool (yeah, I know like, ) to improve his English.

iguanamon thanks again for all your help with my Spanish and what to do next, your advice and the resources you send my way are beyond helpful for me.

[iguanamon]

No hay de qué, Bex. You live in Spain, you've outed yourself now . This is why it's helpful to list where you are because we can help you better. Now I understand the obsessive focus on Iberian Spanish. Since the vast majority of the Spanish-speaking population of the world is on this side of the Atlantic, sharing a continent with the largest English -speaking country in the world, it stands to reason that most of the learning resources will be geared towards the Americas. Still there's enough out there for you peninsulares to use. In this case, I'd probably buy a copy of Assimil's Using Spanish, since it is Spain focused.

Even though now that, I know where you live, I still stand by my recommendations. Spanish is Spanish. It's not much of a problem to adjust to either version if you're making an effort to do so. The Centro Virtual Cervantes (Spain) is highly useful though not app based, which means you pretty much have to be sitting in front of a computer or tablet hooked up to the internet in order to take advantage of them. They have a free series of online graded readers that go from "beginner" to "intermediate" and "advanced" at Lecturas paso a paso. I've already talked about the grammar lessons at the CVC's Aveteca plus Gramática de uso del español , which is also Spain based. In addition, I'd definitely look at EFE's (Spain) Práctica Español site for plenty of useful material.

"Learnt" and you got my Liverpool joke (true story that). Blimey, you're English!

¡Suerte!

[klvik]

Veinte Mundos is a great resource. If you would like something with a more conversational style, take a look at the three resources listed below. I think they have approximately the same degree of difficulty as Veinte Mundos and they use Iberian Spanish.

http://www.podclub.ch/sendungen/a-mi-aire-sp
http://www.spanishpodcast.org/podcasts/
https://www.spanishpodcast.net/listado-episodios/

[garyb]

Regarding tutors, I'm not sure how much you need one given your level and location, but I'm sure it wouldn't do any harm! My experience is that the main difference between Community and Professional tutors on iTalki isn't quality of teaching, it's availability and reliability. Community tutors generally teach part-time in between work and/or studies, so compared to a full-time professional they'll probably have fewer (or less consistent) time slots and more often than not they'll stop teaching as soon as the rest of life gets too busy. If you're flexible and just want conversation practice, that's not really a problem, but if you're looking to work with one person longer-term then it can be worth paying the extra for a pro.

For podcasts, I second the recommendation for "A mi aire", and if you can understand that then RTVE podcasts like Nómadas and Futuro Abierto shouldn't be challenging.

[Bex]

Veinte Mundos is a great resource. If you would like something with a more conversational style, take a look at the three resources listed below. I think they have approximately the same degree of difficulty as Veinte Mundos and they use Iberian Spanish.

http://www.podclub.ch/sendungen/a-mi-aire-sp
http://www.spanishpodcast.org/podcasts/
https://www.spanishpodcast.net/listado-episodios/

Klvik, I have had quick browse of all three and they look fantastic, very conversational, exactly what I was looking for thank you. Veinte Mundos and these will keep me going for a while - once I work out a method for working with them

Regarding tutors, I'm not sure how much you need one given your level and location, but I'm sure it wouldn't do any harm!

Thanks garyb i am not sure I need a tutor as I am happy to self teach (I did attend a Spanish class for a few months, god it was awful) but I definitely need some speaking practice. I am very shy and I struggle to start conversations in English let alone Spanish. I am hoping that once I have had some conversations with a tutor, I can overcome my fears and start speaking to my neighbours

Still struggling to pick a tutor though, there are too many options on italki and I don't know where to start!