Systematiker's attempt at a log

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Brun Ugle
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Brun Ugle » Mon Feb 27, 2017 6:53 pm

A similar argument goes on in my head every couple of days. Except my temptations aren't even things I'd have any hope of understanding for years. Except French, that might not take long to get to a good level of reading comprehension at least.
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blaurebell
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby blaurebell » Mon Feb 27, 2017 7:21 pm

I think your little :twisted: needs to find better excuses! I totally *needed* to learn French because it's the only language that had an Advanced Russian Assimil. And no, there are no other resources in German, English and Spanish :roll: :lol: :roll: Besides there were about 100 pages in French I needed to read for my PhD without any translation in any other language available. I mean ... 100 pages! But you know, when all it takes is spending a summer reading Harry Potter while being too frustrated to do anything else anyway ...! Who am I to argue with my strange urges, especially when I then get to read strange French translations from Japanese that would otherwise be unavailable to me? Isn't there anything totally weird you always wanted to read / do that is only possible through knowing Portuguese? :twisted:
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Systematiker » Wed Mar 01, 2017 2:30 am

Enablers, the lot of you!

I've even come up with a few useful reasons to have some Portuguese, though not anything I couldn't manage with English and Spanish already...

Yet...

I started watching 3% on Netflix, which with the (L2) subtitles on I follow pretty well (maybe 85-90% without struggle). So I guess I'll work in some Portuguese now. I've listened to the first two discs of MT and downloaded the RTP play app as well. I'll have to out in some foundation work to not just get portuñol (or, as I've now learned, portunhal) but it shouldn't be much trouble. I'll probably read through the assimil course (though not really "do" it) and then get a novel or something. Ogrim's plan for Portuguese is kind of mine as well, though his Spanish is better than mine (he described it in the thread on European Portuguese resources).

On the topic of assimil, I've decided to push through the Catalan course. I had neglected it a bit, because I'm on native materials already, but it's got some useful stuff. I'll just do the passive wave, I think, and probably several lessons daily until I wrap it up. I don't think I'll have the patience to go back through an active wave.

I'm super tempted to say that the Torah is enough for Swedish right now in the bible plan, I can't keep up the pensum of so many chapters daily in Swedish. I may switch it out with another language for the rest of that plan (90 days) and do an NT run in Swedish when I get a slot open (about 20 days, then it's about 5 chapters daily vs 12-15). It would probably be best to replace it with French, since it would strengthen a more important language and one which needs the bolstering to get where I'm headed...but it's tempting to do it in Catalan or even Portuguese instead.

I read John 1 in welsh using readlang yesterday as well, which was really cool, I only looked up about 40% of the words.

Oh, and I have no idea how, but I got included in a Lutheran Lenten devotional group in French (seriously, I don't know the organizers, how they got my email, or how they know I speak French) - so that will be a nice experience. Both content and the chance to actually use my French.

Ash Wednesday tomorrow - I'll have to move my ash in the morning :D
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Systematiker
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Systematiker » Sat Mar 04, 2017 12:35 am

All right, so this week...

If you saw it in the FSI utility thread, you'll know that I got really irritated about my lack of speaking facility (or at least its being well behind my reading and listening) on Wednesday, so a lot of my time is now invested in doing all the drills and dialogs from FSI. All of them. I started doing this Wednesday and am on unit 14 now - I'm not learning anything new (not true, I didn't know the word for pillowcases, but I still don't know it, so oh well). So that's the plan for the next couple of weeks - of course, I decide to do this literally the day after I succumb to starting Portuguese, so there's that much more I'm neglecting...

So yeah, I've done a tiny amount of listening in Spanish, French, and Catalan, and an even tinier amount in Swedish. I've kept up my reading plans - by deciding that after the Torah, that plan is going to French, I can't handle that pensum in Swedish. I'm also doing some other reading in Spanish and French, of course. Watching is what is mostly getting the axe at the moment.

I'm probably just going to put most everything else on hold for a couple of weeks, if I can follow my plan I'll be done with FSI on the 20th or so, that's not so bad. I'll still keep up a little bit in languages that I can do native stuff with ease, so I'll make progress in French, Swedish, Danish, and Catalan at least. I'll probably do some Portuguese as well. Everything else, though, I won't give it the time slot until I get through this crazy plan (I'll probably do clozemaster, but that's about it unless I need a palate cleanser). I don't expect to make any progress in anything until I'm done.

If it works, though, I'll start dividing my time back up across the other languages, and keep a slot to do a unit of FSI French each day. I mean, hey, if it works, I should do it for some others as well; I know I will be able to handle that rate in French, and can probably do it for Swedish as well afterward. I may even give it a shot for Portuguese, it'll be a heck of a lot faster. It's a shame that it wouldn't work for something like Russian or Korean - it only flies because it's literally just drilling for me, not the introduction of anything new (OK, Swedish and Portuguese won't be that way, but they're both transparent enough that it won't be the same strain).

Lessons learned so far from cramming 14 units of FSI into three days: either by virtue of so much time in Spanish or the actual drills, I have more fluency in spoken Spanish. Also, my stream-of-consciousness ends up in Spanish at times.

So yeah, I'm not giving up on anything else, I'm just focussing in for two weeks on something. I hope it works.
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Brun Ugle
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Brun Ugle » Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:07 am

How do you do 14 units of FSI in three days?! :shock: I thought I was going pretty fast now with my two or three units a week. Of course, I do each one twice, but even if I did them only once, that wouldn't be more than four to six units a week.
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blaurebell
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby blaurebell » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:07 pm

I wonder whether doing FSI so quickly might actually make it less effective? After all your brain has to have time to adapt too! Well, let us know how you're getting on!
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Systematiker » Sat Mar 04, 2017 1:53 pm

When you think about me "doing FSI" like this, you've got to remember, I'm not learning Spanish with FSI, I'm attempting to automate Spanish with FSI. From what I understand, the drills were initially meant to overlearn the habit of speaking the correct grammar in the correct situation.

So I do the following:
1. listen to the "dialogue for listening", repeating in the natural pauses, then do it again, shadowing (speaking the sentences along with the speaker). This takes less than five minutes, unless I shadow it twice. I skip the "dialogue for learning" entirely.
2. Do the drills. I have thus far always given the correct response unless I misunderstood the audio or didn't understand what I was replacing the first time (or once, I heard "està abriendo" as "estaba riendo" and wondered where the change intense came from :lol: )
3. Skip the conversation stimulus entirely.

That makes each unit about 45 minutes, with me talking at least half the time. All audio, no book. Probably anything that gets me speaking for 20+ hours across the different grammar usages will have the same effect. Well, if it works. I figure doing so many so quickly won't be that big of a deal, since I'm really just using it to practice speaking with reinforcement, not learning as such.
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby jeff_lindqvist » Sat Mar 04, 2017 6:32 pm

I used a similar approach like you the first time I worked with FSI German - only one unit per day, though. Only audio, no books. I shadowed whatever I could shadow and did my best at the drills. This was ten years ago, and I had some experience with the language from school and self-studies. I think my enthusiasm lasted two weeks, but hey, that was a whole course!

At your level of Spanish, I can definitely see that rushing through FSI is a method to automate the language.
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Systematiker
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Systematiker » Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:44 am

Comprehensive update time!

Spanish
ES Reading: 2114 / 10000 ES Film: 89 / 200
My tolerance for hours of daily drills didn't hold up through the weekend, so I'm behind on the FSI project. I've only done through 17, and I should (for my schedule) be done with 23 today...but I did finish of El Ministerio del Tiempo, and I think I'm going to re-watch the entire series with my wife. I'm also up to date on the reading plans and still getting daily listening. I'll strech my FSI plan to the end of the month at most - if I'm still behind then, I'll finish it as I can, rather than hurting everything else even more for it.

Catalan
CAT Reading: 0 / 10000 CAT Film : 4 / 200
I'm through unit 29 of Assimil, but otherwise this has been pretty much on hold.

French
FR Reading: 749 / 10000 FR Film: 55 / 200
A bit of watching, some podcasts, and plugging along on the French portion of the Bible plan - it's easier to keep up to date. Shame I don't have OT audio, or I'd L-R at least part of it. Maybe I will for the NT, when I get there.

Portuguese
PT Reading: 0 / 10000 PT Film: 3 / 200
I'm reading through Assimil (sin esfuerzo) and have not only watched a bit of 3% (good comprehension, has subtitles) but also begun Ministério do Tempo - lower production values are noticeable; my comprehension is also lower. I think I got about as much out of the first episode as I did when I first watched the Spanish version. Unfortunately, I'm not likely to get the same results by the end, since there's only one season up, and in Spanish I also went and watched a couple seasons of something else before returning because of that comprehension problem...it's still enjoyable, though. I'll probably find a book to read soon, and/or cycle in a Bible plan. Cognates are a wonderful thing, and I'm getting help from at least four languages so far. I've got audio for the Bible, too; I may L-R the NT.

Swedish
SV Reading: 455 / 10000 SV Film: 29 / 200
I'm relatively pleased with where I am right now. I have a pretty good passive understanding of most things, so I'm not too worried about the fact that I'm not doing much aside from the occasional podcast right now. I'm going to do another (lower intensity!) Bible plan with Swedish, something with the NT, and I hope to see similar improvement as with the last 300-odd pages of reading. That might get me back to novels with a bit more clarity, and when I've got time, I'll get back into watching.

Danish
DK Reading: 25 / 10000 DK Film: 5 / 200
Is de facto on hold, mostly because I'm still struggling with materials. I'm even listening a bit less, to be honest. It'll come, though I may never finish the film section.

Gaelic
On hold. I can't do much aside from course-stuff or the Bible, and those "slots" are already taken.

Basque
On hold.

Welsh
On hold. Though SSiW is probably the first candidate for an empty time when I can't face more audio drills but can concentrate enough to actually learn something.

Latin
Not actively looking to improve at the moment, as I've got other priorities. I'd like to be better, but it's simply a matter of utility. I'm good enough for what I need at the moment.

Ancient Greek
Much like Latin, though I've got a change in routine coming that's going to give me some "included" work every week.

Finnish
On hold.

Hebrew
Look, I really was going for Modern Hebrew because everyone I know who keeps a decent level of Biblical Hebrew is either (1) a scholar in that area (OT, Judaica, etc.) or (2) also speaks and uses Modern Hebrew. I don't think it's enough reason for me. The Biblical Hebrew, well, I'm not as bad at translating passages as I thought I was, and in a few months it will get the same treatment Greek does, so I'll give it some more attention then. Surely there are people who can keep their Biblical Hebrew without being in one of those two categories, right?

Arabic
I'm probably going to chalk this up as abandoned again. I'd like to learn it, but it's going to take a major investment to do so, and I have too many irons in the fire.

Korean
I'm not giving up on Korean yet. I still haven't lost any of the progress I've made so far, I just need a tiny bit of discipline to work a minimal amount of progress into my schedule. There's no shame for me here anymore, I've been fighting Korean off and on for over a decade now.

Scots
How much maintenance does this really take? On hold.

Russian
On hold, but really only until the end of the month.

Dutch
Yeah we should all know this is on hold by now.
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Systematiker
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Re: Systematiker's attempt at a log

Postby Systematiker » Wed Mar 08, 2017 1:02 am

FSI project? What's that? No, today was about podcasts, mostly Catalan and Spanish, and some Portuguese (and one in Danish!). And then watching stuff in French and Portuguese. And actually using Spanish, Portuguese, and Swedish - something else I do when I have time is HEMA, and I've found some interesting resources on a Swedish site for the German style I do, as well as lots of stuff for La Verdadera Destreza and for a Portuguese style as well...well, at least I know that there's the occasional use for some of these languages!

Seriously, though, I've got locked-in audio-only time tomorrow, and I'm totally going to make progress on this FSI project. And hey, the day's not (quite) over...
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