Островная крепость Хммм

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Xmmm
Orange Belt
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Sat Jan 07, 2017 8:51 pm

I read Professor Arguelles' article on "The Six Most Important Languages" some time back and it made an impression on me. But I've never been to visualize how I would fill the slots for myself. This week I came up with something:


ancestral: Latin, Icelandic
broader sphere: Italian
world: Russian
exotic: Turkish, Indonesian

I have a reasonably legitimate reason for each of those languages. For instance, Turkey has an interesting history and I'm into history. Indonesia is an ex-colony with all the color that entails, beside which I'm a practitioner of pentjak silat (Indonesian martial art). So none of the choices are totally off the wall like "maybe I'll learn Burmese or Xhosa just because."

I really would be better off sticking to only Russian for the next couple of years, but it's hard for me to maintain focus on one thing for 2-3 hours a day.


Русский

I was reading yet another radio transcript and hit a section where I started reading the Russian transparently. It didn't last long, but was pretty exciting while it was happening.

: 10778 / 20000 Words Known (2017 goal 20000)
: 1314682 / 2000000 Words Read (2017 goal 2 m)
: 48 / 300 Hours Listened (2017 goal 300)
: 6 / 100 Glossika GSR 1


Italiano

Uneventful. News in Slow Italian is working fine.

: 1921 / 6000 Words Known (2017 goal 6000)
: 47121 / 500000 Words Read (2017 goal 500000)
: 6 / 100 Hours Listened (2017 goal 100)


Türkçe

I really don't want to lose the focus on Russian, so my only goal for Turkish for 2017 is to hit level 25 in Duolingo.

: 5 / 25 Duolingo Level
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Xmmm
Orange Belt
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:23 am

I feel like my approach to learning Russian (assimil + lingq) left me with a grammar deficit.
I'm sure it will be gone after I read five or ten million words, but in the meantime it's a little frustrating.
There are also some basic words ("roof") that you don't get from Russian current affairs radio broadcasts.

So for new languages, I'm thinking I should do this:

1. Duo tree
2. Duo to 25th level through review + Glossika
3. LingQ

And for Russian, I'm going to back and finish the duo tree that I abandoned previously. It may not be the
best way to learn grammar, but it's the only way I can tolerate. I have a fancy grammar book sitting untouched ...


Русский

I will continue to make forward progress in reading/listening due to my beeminder goal. But I'm adding Duo to
fill in any grammar gaps.


: 10948 / 20000 Words Known (2017 goal 20000)
: 1330152 / 2000000 Words Read (2017 goal 2 m)
: 49 / 300 Hours Listened (2017 goal 300)
: 10 / 100 Glossika GSR 1
: 13 / 25 Duolingo Level



Italiano

I'm really a false beginner in this language due to previous exposure to Spanish and French. Adding
the Duolingo goal here as well for good order's sake.

: 2051 / 6000 Words Known (2017 goal 6000)
: 50738 / 500000 Words Read (2017 goal 500000)
: 7 / 100 Hours Listened (2017 goal 100)
: 9 / 25 Duolingo Level


Türkçe

FSI rates Turkish and Russian as being equally difficult (1100 hours). From my first couple of weeks of study,
I find that hard to believe. Turkish seems considerably more alien, despite the quasi-Latin alphabet. Fun, though.

: 7 / 25 Duolingo Level
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zebracoupe
White Belt
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2015 12:46 am
Languages: Japanese (C1), German (B1), Russian (just beginning)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby zebracoupe » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:03 pm

Xmmm wrote:Русский

I was reading yet another radio transcript and hit a section where I started reading the Russian transparently. It didn't last long, but was pretty exciting while it was happening.



What do you mean by "reading transparently"? Is this when you are not mentally translating into English as you read, but just getting the meaning direct from the Russian text?
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neofight78
Green Belt
Posts: 304
Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2015 8:02 pm
Location: Novosibirsk, Russia
Languages: English (N), Russian (B2+)
Language Log: viewtopic.php?t=833
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby neofight78 » Fri Jan 13, 2017 2:17 pm

Xmmm wrote:I feel like my approach to learning Russian (assimil + lingq) left me with a grammar deficit.
I'm sure it will be gone after I read five or ten million words, but in the meantime it's a little frustrating.
There are also some basic words ("roof") that you don't get from Russian current affairs radio broadcasts.


Regarding grammar, my feeling is that it really does pay to do some study. Someone (I forget who) did tell that they normally didn't bother with studying grammar but with Russian they had to make an exception. Certainly I have encountered cases where people where relatively fluently (i.e. spoke quickly with a good grip of vocab) but with no idea on grammar, and even for me as a non-native it was painful to listen to. Anyhow, I would encourage you to find a way to study grammar, even if it's a small amount a day. I guess it's a question of finding a way of studying that suits you. I create flashcards for a given rule with illustrative sentences. L1 on the front L2 with audio on the back, and I answer out loud. Plenty of other ways to skin a cat of course....

Sounds like you should mix up your sources a bit more, or perhaps engage in some supplementary vocabulary study. One thing I've started doing is using a frequency dictionary, ticking off the words are know and learning the one's I don't. It's not my main source of vocab study, but it's a way of filling some key gaps. Maybe you can find some suitable material at Первый канал or Школа Жизни. Both sites have plenty of audio and transcripts.
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Xmmm
Orange Belt
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Fri Jan 13, 2017 2:40 pm

zebracoupe wrote:
Xmmm wrote:Русский

I was reading yet another radio transcript and hit a section where I started reading the Russian transparently. It didn't last long, but was pretty exciting while it was happening.



What do you mean by "reading transparently"? Is this when you are not mentally translating into English as you read, but just getting the meaning direct from the Russian text?



Yes. I read about two paragraphs directly in Russian without doing any mental translation. Felt like reading English. Lasted about eight seconds but felt great while it was happening.
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Xmmm
Orange Belt
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:13 pm

neofight78 wrote:
Xmmm wrote:I feel like my approach to learning Russian (assimil + lingq) left me with a grammar deficit.
I'm sure it will be gone after I read five or ten million words, but in the meantime it's a little frustrating.
There are also some basic words ("roof") that you don't get from Russian current affairs radio broadcasts.


Regarding grammar, my feeling is that it really does pay to do some study. Someone (I forget who) did tell that they normally didn't bother with studying grammar but with Russian they had to make an exception. Certainly I have encountered cases where people where relatively fluently (i.e. spoke quickly with a good grip of vocab) but with no idea on grammar, and even for me as a non-native it was painful to listen to. Anyhow, I would encourage you to find a way to study grammar, even if it's a small amount a day. I guess it's a question of finding a way of studying that suits you. I create flashcards for a given rule with illustrative sentences. L1 on the front L2 with audio on the back, and I answer out loud. Plenty of other ways to skin a cat of course....

Sounds like you should mix up your sources a bit more, or perhaps engage in some supplementary vocabulary study. One thing I've started doing is using a frequency dictionary, ticking off the words are know and learning the one's I don't. It's not my main source of vocab study, but it's a way of filling some key gaps. Maybe you can find some suitable material at Первый канал or Школа Жизни. Both sites have plenty of audio and transcripts.


That is good advice all around, neofight. Thanks!

I've used Школа Жизни before and agree it's a much broader cross section of vocabulary. I guess I find the articles a little hokey ("Did you ever wonder how they make mushroom tea?") but need to get over that. I will definitely check out Первый канал.

Re grammar: okay. I will start by finishing Duolingo and get my grammar up to an A2 first. I have the big Wade (?) grammar and workbook, I just keep avoiding it. I need to get over that as well.
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neofight78
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Posts: 304
Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2015 8:02 pm
Location: Novosibirsk, Russia
Languages: English (N), Russian (B2+)
Language Log: viewtopic.php?t=833
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby neofight78 » Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:40 pm

Xmmm wrote:I've used Школа Жизни before and agree it's a much broader cross section of vocabulary. I guess I find the articles a little hokey ("Did you ever wonder how they make mushroom tea?") but need to get over that. I will definitely check out Первый канал.


Yeah it's pretty goofy stuff, although there are some decent articles to be found.

Xmmm wrote:Re grammar: okay. I will start by finishing Duolingo and get my grammar up to an A2 first. I have the big Wade (?) grammar and workbook, I just keep avoiding it. I need to get over that as well.


I should avoid Wade for the time being, it's a big comprehensive (although at higher level I'm finding out that it's not that comprehensive) textbook. It's much more suitable as a reference book. I would choose something more aimed at beginners/course like. There are plenty of options, I quite liked "Russian Grammar You Really Need To Know", although a lot of people like "The New Penguin Russian Course". As a beginner I used the free online course from RT. It's a pretty good resource and you can find the answers to the exercises here
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Xmmm
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Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Fri Jan 20, 2017 2:00 am

Русский

I'm trapped in remedial grammar hell at the moment so words read and learned is not moving up much.

I have 27 skills remaining to finish the Duolingo tree. Very much review,
I know all the stuff -- except when I have to type it out, when I invariably get one ending wrong.

I've started Learning Russian RT on neofight's recommendation. It looks very thorough. I've have to see how long
my willpower holds out though.


: 11197 / 20000 Words Known (2017 goal 20000)
: 1346654 / 2000000 Words Read (2017 goal 2 m)
: 53 / 300 Hours Listened (2017 goal 300)
: 16 / 100 Glossika GSR 1
: 13 / 25 Duolingo Level
: 3 / 100 Learning Russian RT




Italiano

This language is so relaxing after Russian.

: 2142 / 6000 Words Known (2017 goal 6000)
: 54284 / 500000 Words Read (2017 goal 500000)
: 8 / 100 Hours Listened (2017 goal 100)
: 10 / 25 Duolingo Level


Türkçe

Still a complete word salad once I go much beyond "ben su içerim."

: 8 / 25 Duolingo Level
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User avatar
Xmmm
Orange Belt
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:22 pm

Русский

Fourteen skills left for Duolingo Russian.

I'm not doing very much reading at the moment but I did re-watch the first ten episodes of Interns. I was happy to see my listening comprehension has improved significantly since I gave up watching the show out of frustration a year ago.

: 11265 / 20000 Words Known (2017 goal 20000)
: 1349357 / 2000000 Words Read (2017 goal 2 m)
: 57 / 300 Hours Listened (2017 goal 300)
: 20 / 100 Glossika GSR 1
: 14 / 25 Duolingo Level
: 3 / 100 Learning Russian RT




Italiano

43 remaining Duolingo skills.

I was able to watch the first couple of episodes of Un Passo dal Cielo with a surprising amount of comprehension (which I attribute to my A2-ish listening skills in Spanish). But what is the deal with Rai TV? Almost all shows are blocked in the US and I think I'm watching the 2011 season of Un Passo dal Cielo only because they forgot to block that one. I know there are vpn ways to bypass the blockers, but is there any legal way to buy a license or something? It seems a trifle bizarre that they would block me from watching when I could be "free money" for them.

The Rai TV model (block and prohibit potential paying customers) is almost as weird as the Russian TV model (showing everything to the world for free with no ads) but the Russian model works better for me.


: 2142 / 6000 Words Known (2017 goal 6000)
: 54284 / 500000 Words Read (2017 goal 500000)
: 11 / 100 Hours Listened (2017 goal 100)
: 11 / 25 Duolingo Level


Türkçe

43 remaining Duolingo skills.

I tried watching about ten minutes of Turkish TV to see if I could understand even a word. I picked an action show, which had very dramatic high quality opening credits .... and then immediately went into a ridiculous fight scene (eighty year old sleeping mother with cane floors four sons who are wide awake and trying to surprise her with a visit). Unfortunate. Didn't catch a single work but heard some of those "usunuz" and "misiniz" sounds.

: 9 / 25 Duolingo Level
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Xmmm
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Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 1:19 am
Location: США
Languages: English (N), Russian (intermediate), Italian (beginner)
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Re: Xmmm's Russian log

Postby Xmmm » Sat Jan 28, 2017 4:22 pm

I'm happy to say I've found what looks like a great Turkish TV show. Last night I watched 88 minutes of Vatanim Sensin.

I started on episode 13, and I was only able to pick out four words (evet, hayir, benim, sizin). So I would say my listening comprehension is zero. But it looks like a great show. Fast paced historical drama. 8.4/10 rating on Imdb (!).

The guy in the top right corner is named Miralai or something like that. It seems like he was a talented army officer who turned to evil, betrayed people, killed people, and is now desperately trying to keep all his crimes covered up. The actor really had a field day playing this character in episode 13. Seems like events are slipping out of his control moment by moment.

vatanim-sensin.jpg
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